How did the short-sale impact your personal income tax situation? This to me would be a huge concern, especially if I were already in a tax trap.
09/21/07

Stephanie,

First, what is the real value on the property and what to do you owe?
Second, are you late? how many months? do you live in the home?

Brennan

How short is the sale if you don’t mind me asking? We are dealing with the same scenario. We have been waiting on a reply for almost 60 days from Countrywide and we think the sale is less than 10K short.

I’m waiting for a response on a home I want to buy short sale from Countrywide. We have been waiting since February 1.

I was working on a short sale as the selling agent. This was for a condo mortgaged with Countrywide. I was told today that as of April 1, they would not be doing anymore short sales.

We have been waiting on areply from the 2nd got a counter offer two weeks post Og. offer @ 489k we complied and it is now foing on 3and 1/2 weeks and have still no word

my husband and i put an offer in on a countrywide short sale in December 07 we just found out that it was forclosed on and they did not accept the short sale. The bad part is that we got a verbal yes a month ago from one negotiator then it changed hands and went through three other negotiator before it was denied. five months is a long time to find out no when we were only 20k below her mortgage. How will the market improve if they son’t offload these houses?

I am attempting to have countrywide ok a short sale on my home in Florida currently and after initially oking it they are now saying that they only “Service” the loan and that an actual other bank holds it and they will not ok the short sale unless we are behind in payments…. this sounds outragous to me as they are, in effect, asking them to not pay them…. has anyone else run into this problem? and if so what can be done….
It would be in EVERYone’s best interest to just ok the short sale because they will be losing less money….. the only other option would be for me to not pay them.

I am working on a short sale in FL. I got the same situation that they wouldnt do anything unless I was behind in payments…so i started paying it at 59 days…The realtor I have has said that they have had no issues with a short sale before but most problems with a short sale is that the people within the bank do not know what they are talking about and you have to keep asking for someone else until they give you what you want..Also, a verbal agreement unless recorded cannot be used it must be in writing or they can alter it. Our process just started and I have read many of these websites and I am very concerned with this process but have no choice due to many personal situations…

What’s happening with Countrywide and some other major lenders, is they’ve decided that it would be in their best interest to let many of their loans go into total default and foreclosure. If the borrower has PMI on the loan (mortgage insurance) it may make more sense for them in this market to foreclose on the property, collect the mortgage insurance, and then resell the property as the market improves. It’s an incredibly sad example of just how morally bankrupt, bottom-line driven, and unconcerned about customer care this nation’s business environment has become. I’m a professional Realtor with ton of experience. Countrywide is by far the worst company I’ve ever had to deal with. Customer care is practically non-existent, the work-out department is completely incompetent, the loss mitigation department is nothing more than a debt collection agency posing as Countrywide, and the company is clearly only interested in cutting losses and moving on – leaving many of their customer’s shattered lives in their wake. Very depressing indeed.

Countrywide is incredibly predatory. There is so much more behind the scenes that we, as sellers and Realtors, do not understand. Countrywide really prefers to foreclose. That is why they demand a higher than market value for a property. People who think that lenders would prefer a short sale to the greater loss of foreclosure just don’t know lender logic. Can anyone shed light on why Countrywide prefers foreclosure than to accept a really good market value offer before foreclosure?

I’ve no doubt they are overwhelmed, but it’s a nightmare of their own making and IF that is the case, the should be jumping through hoops to help those who are bringing them short sales on a plate that they just have to glance at and approve. the short sale I am attempting with them is only $30K under the loan amount and only TEN under market value at the moment. they longer they wait and the longer they continue with this the market is going to keep going south and they will end up losing more money. Don’t they realize that it’s their continued apathy that is helping to FUEL the down turn?

We’ve been dealing with CW for 4 months now and have extended the time of our initial offer twice. For three weeks we’ve been hearing it’s been verbally approved yet didn’t see anything officially “signed off” until today. They’ve FINALLY APPROVED the sale in WRITING.

Other than patience, the only other advice I would give buyers is to involve your lender. The seller gave our lender written permission to contact Countrywide and once he (our lender) called CW, action started to happen. Our lender was patient (having to deal with a bunch of different CW staff members) and finally got to the proper CW negotiator. He basically mentioned that we qualified for the loan and that we are ready to get the deal done. He asked if the offer was reasonable and was told yes. My lender also contacted the owners to get certain docs to CW and encouraged them to stay in communication with CW. I know 4 months is a long time but financially it was worth the wait for us. Once the appraiser checks it out, this is a done deal.

Tiffany,

From my understanding, they had a 80% primary and 20% second for 100% financing (home was purchased 5/07). We’ made an offer that was 14.2% lower than their purchase price.

Our initial offer was roughly 5K less than our purchase price (initial offer was made 12/27/07) and the appraisal was performed in January 2008. CW said no to the first offer so we walked. The seller called us up two weeks later stating if we add just a tiny more to the offer CW should accept so we added 5K on our offer made the first week of February.

I’m mentioning this to you because we’re getting the home 4 months after the appraisal. Had I known to get my lender involved earlier, I think I would have chopped off a month or two off that time period.

I would believe your chances are very good in obtaining the home because the cost of foreclosure is pricey to the bank (unless the avg home in Katy, TX is worth less than 100k).

Don’t be surprised if you have to wait a couple of months though.

Another item, the seller needs to get the proper docs to CW and should keep them ready to submit. The current owners of our purchase had to resubmit them a couple of times. If the sellers of the house that you’re interested in don’t stay on top of CW, this can drag the decision making by CW.

I am a seller with a countrywide mortgage. My realtor and I just listed the property after calling countrywide and discussing short sale.

Since my equity vanished the day we listed the property, please help me understand why, as seller, I am concerned about the disposition of the home. I have never had anything like this happen to me before and am having trouble figuring out where this situation goes.

Can you change your mind and go with a deed in lieu if the short sale drags on for too long? Since I am not making mortgage payments, why would I want to do this? Is it that the credit score gets worse with each passing payment that doesn’t happen? Would the lender prefer this? If so why? Could the lender be thinking that they can hold property for long enough to reap the benefits of market recovery?

Hardship….
It doesn’t matter if you overstated your income then or not. The fact of the matter is, as a realtor you definitely are NOT making the money you were then. They want to see 2 months bank statements, current pay stubs, your monthly expenses, has anyone given you the forms to fill out for the lender? There is a list of items that the lender needs to see if you qualify. One of them is a financial statement. They need to know what you make and ALL your expenses. They want a hardship letter, a letter stating what has changed that you cannot afford the house.

How do you find out who the negotiator is and their contact information?
I have asked the Short Sale Support group and no one will answer that questions.

I just got an appraisal completed after waiting several months, we plan on inspections being completed if CW accepts our offer- how does CW handle negative inspections- will they be willing to cover any significant issues? The sellers realtor told us they believed CW would but from what I am reading another negotiation will just add more time to the clock.

AS-IS Where-is and the best no hassle payment arangements possible are what the bank will be looking for. Your offer in my opinion should be reflective of the property in AS-IS sale. Any time you expect to change or renegotiate a contract it will delay things…now compund that in the short-sale situation and it might doom your approval. When you are contacted by the negotiator finally they will ask you to verify, and update any information so they can submit for approval. Lets say your inspection does not take place until after the negotiator has received an approval, you will be told that you have been approved for X amount and you are not approved for anything else without a resubmitting for approval. That’s were it could fall appart.

Henry-

We are in the same boat as you except we are the sellers. I call countrywide daily and they always give me the run around. I finally got to a managers voicemail today so hopefully I get a call back. Our short sale was sent up in March the offer and the package is complete. The Appraisal was done 2 months ago and a negotiater was assigned May 7th. I was first told 7 days, then 15 days, finally 30 days for a negotiator to get back with us. Hopefully we get a call today…
Nicoel

Thank you. I guess we are stuck waiting to see what happens with the initial offer since I don’t want to risk changing terms now, unfortunately the house is detiorating rapidly and we would have put in a much lower offer had we decided to take as is.

I made an offer on a Countrywide property on a short sale March 8 in Florida…not ONE word from them.. my agent called and they say they will call when they have time.

If I am approved for a short sale and the home is sold, does the lender have the right to come after me for the remaining balance at a later time?

Staying Positive Said…
“When you do speak with your negotiator they will be short, businesslike, and direct.”
When I call, they tell me the name of the negotiator, but I have YET been able to speak to them directly. How do you even get to the negotiator once they’ve been assigned. I’ve called so many times and I’m extremely frustrated.

CW is the 2nd mortgage holder on the property and it’s been under contract since Jan, with CW having ALL of the info needed including the appraisal since mid-April and I can’t get anywhere with them… The foreclosure is due to happen next week and all I need is a letter from them stating that they will accept the short sale to delay for 30 days. I have a CASH buyer, but I just can’t get an answer from CW. I am extremely frustrated.

Great, but depressing, website.

With the documented problems of obtaining a short sale from Countrywide, why not just go to foreclosure?

It appears that with the delay everyone has experienced that buyers vanish and the eventual outcome is foreclosure anyway.

What are the actual negatives of forclosure?

Countrywide will quote you:

30-45 days to get the file into the hands of an actual decision maker

From there

They have 15 days to call you

These are all business days, so you’re looking at 6 to 9 weeks before you get to your negotiator.

If you have a good realtor that knows the short sales process they will be calling every day. Yes, every day. Countywide will lose faxes, “misplace” documents like Hud1’s, offers, etc to slow the process. We all know these are unethical business practices. But whoever said Countrywide was an ethical company? (Look for a class action in 12 to 24 months?)
I’m sorry to say you have to be very organized, keep notes, keep fax confirmations, let them know : I have a fax confirmation from June 11th at 1:30pm and June 16th at 11:43am that says 26 pages sent “confirmed”. Where is the fax?

Also – They change fax numbers weekly – The current number I was sent as of June 24th is 888-491-4947.

GET AGGRESSIVE! Don’t sit waiting for this bank to call you. 9 millions loans, 900K in foreclosure, don’t get lost in the shuffle.

Brennan Watkins
Coldwell Banker Arizona

I wish that I had found this blog months ago, as my husband and I were starting the short sale process with Countrywide. I am glad to know we are not alone in our frustrations. We are on our third offer and it looks like this one might walk, too.

I have a question for those who have survived this process…how long does the approval process take once the negotiator approves the offer? We are currently at this spot and as usual, Countrywide is giving us the run around. We feel like we see the light at the end of the tunnel. Problem is, our buyer will walk as of Monday if they don’t have an answer. I was under the impression that once the negotiator says “okay” we could go into escrow.

Any advice would be welcome!

Hello,

In response to LJS regarding deficiency judgements….when my short sale closed I ended up $100K short and they didn’t ask for anything to cover that and did not file for a judgement. The “demand letter” they provided actually states the agreement that they will accept the offer amount to release the mortgage lien, and require $0 dollars from the seller.

That is Illinois, but the state law here does not prohibit deficiency judgements.

Hello Everybody,
Countrywide has been nothing but a headache. My property went up for Short Sale March 1st- Had a Buyer by April 1st with offer in. The Appraisal was done April 15th with no negotiator assigned. They told me it would be 15 business days until the negotiator was assigned. My file was finally assigned on June 7th. Since June 7th I have spoke with somebody at Countywide daily getting the same reponse..Your account is being reviewed..I have been transferred to 3 different managers voicemails never got a call back. On three different occations they sent an email to the negotiator and according to their guidelines the negotiator only has 5 days to respond. I never got a response. The Realtor that we are using is totally Lazy. I found the buyer and making all the calls while she sits back and tells me to be patient. When I first started using her she said this process would only take 3-5 weeks max..I was totally mislead and wish that I wouldv’e just foreclosed.

CG,

As to where we are in the process: the appraisal was done May 6th, we were assigned our negotiator around May 30th, we have heard that our negotiator has approved this last offer, and now it has been sent to management/investors for the final approval. Who are these people and do you know if this is the final step? They have had the approved offer for 5 business days. Our agent is trying to keep the buyers on board but as I said before they want to walk on Monday. Our negotiator is not returning our emails and we can’t get anywhere over the phone. I feel like we’re so close!

Our house is in Southern CA and we also have a small home eq loan. Both are with Countrywide.

Stayin Positive,

our HUD1 is up to date and submitted with the offer

Thanks to both for your responses…maybe today is the day?

We’ve been dealing with Countrywide since February 1 for a short sale home we want to buy. We finally thought we would be going to settlement. Countrywide countered our offer. We went up and then we were told it was approved and the final paperwork was in the process of being completed. That was 3 weeks ago. On Monday, my realtor called to tell me that Countrywide now wants to do a COMPARISON appraisal from the original one they did almost 3 months ago. This being after our offer was supposedly “ACCEPTED.” This cannot get any more ridiculous. I am thinking of hiring an attorney because I do not feel anyone is doing anything for us to get Countrywide moving alone. Anyone else hire an attorney?

We have an investment property that is currently rented. The mortgage is a subprime Neg am loan. Currently the balance is abour 475K (and rising monthly), the houses in that area are now listing for about 200K. We have a potential buyer for a short sale who would probably be patient about the process. Should we even bother starting the process with Countrywide for a short sale. I’m hearing that they may not even do it because its investment prop. and that it takes so long that forclosure may be easier? And any consequences like repayment?

This is our second month not paying the mortgage. We were told by the loan modification department that you had to be deficient.

Thanks, Stef

Ugh! This makes me want to scream.

We put an offer in on a house June 30th and we did not know it was a short sale. Apparently even the selling agent didn’t know about the sellers 2nd mortgage with CW (not sure I really believe that). We were then told the sellers agent spent all day on the phone with the lenders and the short sale was approved for our asking price. The seller signed the contract and we had an inspection done Tuesday. At that time the sellers agent said they expected to hear from the bank by Friday which would be about a two week turn around. Of course I’m not holding my breath, but is this even a plausable story? The home is in KC, MO and the 1st is not with Countrywide just the 2nd. I’m guessing they are only 10-20K short and our offer was about 90% of what we think the market value is (in MO it’s hard to get good numbers for that). What should expect and what can I do as the buyer if anything?

Hello,
Here is my situtation. The offer has been in since April for $230,000 dollars. Appraisal was done for the same amount. Everytime I call countrywide I get the same story..The negotiator is currently reviewing the file. My negotiator has been reassigned 3 times. Yasmin was assigned for about 1 month…I left her and her manager 3 voicemails no response back. Now once again the Negotiator has been resassigned to Anthony Palma. The buyer I know personally and he is ready to walk away. My Realtor sits back waiting for her commission. She says she calls Countrywide once a week..Which I find hard to believe because when I send her an email it takes her at least 1 week to respond. Hopefully we get a response this week from the lender with a yes or no.

Nicole

Author: Brennan “That is a pipe dream …. CW takes at least 3 months for a first, longer on seconds. There are law’s around disclusure and that agents needs to get all the facts before listing a home for sale. I am sorry to say … sellers sometimes are not the most honest people in the world either. ”

I know that every file is different and I know many people who post on sites like this are posting b/c they are mad at how things went for them….I haven’t seen posts of any who were happy, but I guess the happy ones are just too busy moving into their new homes.

Since my post I have found that the seller is not very short at all (around 5K) and CW was charging excessive pre-pay fees etc. and basically raking the seller over the coals for a very small loan (as they have been known to do lately). With the deal as written with all commissions CW will still be getting over 50%. I’m guessing CW will be losing that fee money and try to lower the comissions a little, but both agents seem very sure they can get this done.

We have submitted an offer on a CW short sale. After reading all these posts, it seemed like it would be a good idea for me to try and get authorized to call CW directly to find out the status. As of right now we get all of our info from the listing agent and she says she calls once or twice a week. I asked my buyer agent to see if the sellers would list me, or him, or my lender (as Fred suggested above) as an authorized contact to call CW about this short sale. However, the listing agent said that she preferred to be the point of contact with the bank.

We submitted our offer to her at the beginning of June and then found out (after several emails/calls to her) that she did not submit the offer to CW until June 20th!!!!! She said she had trouble getting docs she needed from the sellers and that caused a delay, but still, there was no communication from her about this in those weeks in between. So this makes me not exactly trust her as the sole point of contact to get all this stuff moving along.

So far all we know is that CW did an appraisal last week. The listing agent says that CW has not assigned a work out coordinator yet and thus the appraisal has not been processed yet so they can’t give her any more info. I don’t expect it to get assigned any time soon seeing that the offer didn’t actually get submitted to CW until about 3 weeks ago.

But I have tried to call Countrywide anyway just to see if I could find anything out. I spent several hours calling many different numbers and got no where. I don’t want this to fall between the cracks. The sellers have not made a payment since January and are already out of the house, no NOD has been filed, and we are the only offer on the house so far.

If the listing agent won’t authorize me to call CW, is there anything else we can do to make sure all is in order?

Thanks….
Meiks

Quick question at what point in the process would the HUD be sent to CW? I’m just trying to figure out where we actually are in the process. The sellers agent just sent the HUD to CW.

HUD1 should be sent within 48 hours after the agent receives the offer. That of course if you have a sharp agent. The offer get signed by the seller, goes the listed agents broker from approval, then gets sent to a title company. The title company generates the HUD1. The agent should fax the HUD1 to 1-888-491-4947. You have to call after 48 to confirm they recieved the fax. Note:Make sure the they have the account number on every page of the fax.

I have been waiting for two months for Countrywide to look at an offer regarding a short sale in MN and there hasn’t even been an appraisal ordered yet. It gets ordered then their system somehow cancels it. This has shortened the current home owner’s foreclosure redemption period by two months. Is there any legal ramifications against Countrywide or places to complain? We are about to lose the buyer.

The seller has only two months left of their redemption period. They have a first with CW, a second and a judgment/lien against the property with a credit card issue. It seems like a lot to work out when NOTHING has been done yet.

If the sale does not go through, can the current owner remain in the home after the redemption period, especially if the buyer is still interested? If the buyer gives up and CW doesn’t come through, It is their plan to replace top quality fixtures, etc. with lessor priced items. They’ve done everything possible to keep the property in tip-top condition in order to sell and have it behind them but Countrywide is making it impossible to move ahead. Any ideas?

Thanks.

I posted about a month ago venting my frustrations with CW and I’m back to say… I have a closing scheduled for Friday 7/25. YAY! I’m just holding my breath that nothing goes wrong between now and then.

A little background to give others hope… the offer was made on Jan 23rd (while I was in the hospital having a baby); the appraisal was completed in April; and I finally got to speak to the negotiator sometime the end of June – AFTER I called a few times/day DEMANDING to speak to someone who could move things along as foreclosure was expected to occur within 1-2 weeks (foreclosure was originally scheduled for 6/25, but has been delayed twice). My realtor was also making frequent phone calls on my behalf.

CW is my 2nd mortgage holder and they are accepting $4k on a $50k interest only loan that I took out in May 2006. Thank god, that the tax rules have changed and I won’t be owing taxes on that $46k. My first mortgage (another lender) is being paid in full. At one point, CW wanted my 1st mortgage holder to take some of hit, but they refused because in all honestly, CW made a poor lending decision and the 1st should not be penalized for their bad business practices.

BTW, this is a rental property. I wanted to mention that, because I think I read somewhere that banks will not consider short sales on rentals… as far as I know, mine has been approved and things are moving forward.

I will post again when and if the closing really occurs.

Thank you to amanda and Christy for a glimmer of hope!
My offer was placed in late January, so this is looking like the light at the end of the tunnel.

To Vanessa:
I’d hope Countrywide will be focusing attention on those of us who have had offers sitting for MONTHS before attending to anything newly placed…
If I were you, and you MUST close by the end of August…I dunno, I’d look around… Just my 2 cents…

Hey there Meiks –
I left most of the leg work up to my realtor. I didn’t get involved until foreclosure was imminent. Once I got the foreclosure notice with a date, I was at the point where I just wanted an answer one way or another, because I wanted to do right by my tenants. So, I started called CW and I told them that I was going to call back every few hours until I could get someone that could give me an answer. Of course, with a full time job, I certainly didn’t have the time to be called as frequently as I threatened to, but I definitely called as often as I could. I finally heard from the negotiator about a week and a half later.

The buyer never got involved with the process. He’s buying the property as a rental, so he’s been very patient with the whole process.

My realtor certainly earned his commission on this property if he was calling and badgering CW as often as he said he did… assuming that we will close next Friday as expected… we shall see…

BNL,

You should be real close now to an answer. Once it has left the negotiator it goes for approval, and this is probably what they are calling the analysis team. It took them about 7 business days to come back with an approval which I had to call in to hear about. The negotiator will then prepare what is called a “Demand Letter” that lays out the terms and timeframe. If you need more time to close since they dragged their feel so long on approval make sure to tell the negotiator so that she can provide the time you need in the letter. They will fax or email the letter. I suggest email so that you can have a clean copy. Once you have that letter the clock is ticking…

Good luck to you

Do Countrywide Short Sales ever close???????? I quit making my payments in March so I could go into default just to qualify for a short sale with Countrywide. (they wouldn’t help us any other way). Fortunately, we got a short sale offer in early April. The appraisal was done and received on Countrywide’s desk on May 5th. Countrywide won’t even tell us what the house appraised for. Now we are approaching the end of July with still no approval. We are on our 4th negotiator and are told different stories every time we call to get an update. We do NOT have any PMI on the mortgage. I don’t know if that is helping us or hurting us. We are now told the package is at the last stop and we are still awaiting approval. This last stop just happens to be at the ‘investors’ bank, which we were told is the Bank of New York. I’m wondering if this big bank bale out will help this situation or not. I don’t know if Bank of New York is part of Fannie Mae or Freddie or what the heck. Our buyers have been so patient but how long can they wait? This house is in Florida and everything is either for sale or vacant down there. Why on earth won’t they speed this up? The house is vacant now as well. We had to relocate, Any suggestions?

Kathleen, thank you for your information. I am also going to add a few more things you may interesting. My brother was an excellent residential appraiser who owned his own business, and Countrywide was at one time, his biggest client. About the peek of 2005, my brother stopped appraising deals for the sales price because he could not ethically stomach it. Eventually, he was known as a ‘deal killer’ and was blackballed. He never once regretted sticking to his opinion that properties were overpriced. He saw this crash coming and tried to warn those, but nobody would listen. Now he is considered the smart one after all! He got out of the appraising business altogether and is in another field and far happier. On the bright side………. and you won’t believe this…. but my realtor called me this morning and told me we have the VERBAL approval for our short sale! I about fell on the floor from shock. She was told she would get the papers faxed to her by Wednesday with a closing date listed. Countrywide did accept the buyers offer with no counters. This surprised me, but I guess the offer was good enough for them. My bet is that the appraisal Countrywide had done was lower than the asking price and now the buyer’s appraisal will come into play. We are just ending our 4th month of waiting, and I wanted to say to everyone out there to hang on and just wait. It’s all you can do anyway, and I will post back once we close to assure everyone that miracles do happen! Good luck to all.

What happens if the first mortgage holder and the investors( Fannie Mae have accepted the contract but countrywide is the second mortgage is trying to change the entire sale.

Currently in the process of short-sale of my home in San Diego with Countrywide. I am in the military and am being relocated. I would not be able to make my payments even with renters in the home once I leave. I currently have a good offer on the home. The status is “under review by the Investor”. It was sent to the investor 25 business days (almost 4 actual weeks) ago. The negotiator has not been easily accessible for updates either by my realtor or myself (had good communication previously via email however only seems to respond to threats!). We have found out that the investor is Wells Fargo Bank. Is there any way to speak to the investor directly to push the process along? I am growing very frustrated with Countrywide and my current negotiator. I feel that they could care less whether this deal goes through or the house forecloses. I feel that if they dont make a move here soon this current offer will walk. Any assistance or recommendations are welcome. Thanks!

Just had to chime in and let Mike know that it took Countrywide 4 months to approve our offer as well, like sara.
We placed our offer 1/31, our offer was approved late April, we went into escrow mid to late May and are still not closed.

I’ll post again when we DO close, so you all can have a better idea of how things are going with CW right now.

We have had our house on the market since July of ’07. We requested a short sale the day we signed with our agent. It took CW about 6 months to move us out of the workout department, which was by no means a workout. Once we were assigned to a short sale agent it took another 4 months to receive an appraisal. We have had multiple buyers placing large amounts of money in escrow and one after another and many long months they all pulled out. When CW did finally “approve” one of our buyers is was a buyer that had already pulled out a few months before! we were then told to get another buyer approved it would take 45 days to close the old buyers file and open a new one for approval. We are now on our last buyer who was just sent up for approval and aobut 30 days away from our house being foreclosed on. We have beent the ones in constant contact with Cw. Never the same person, never anyone who knows what they are talking about. We have waited patiently for a year, done everything we were told to do and now we are still having our home taken away from us.

We got approval last Monday, but CW did NOT fax over the papers as promised by Wednesday. My realtor called and was reassured that we were approved, but there was some ‘technicality’ and it had to be redone. They are promising the papers by early next week…..should I hold my breath????

Curious to all you who can’t seem to close….do you guys have PMI?

Seems like CW would rather foreclose on those loans with PMI so they can collect the insurance then resell the property. In our case, we had refinanced and had the PMI dropped a couple of years ago while our property was red hot. CW has the 1st AND 2nd, so don’t know if this is hurting us or helping us. CW had their own appraisal done 3 months ago, and the property is probably worth about 3% less now…keeps going down every month. (Florida). I’m nervous about what the buyer’s appraisal will come in at. Should be done upcoming week. I will post back with updates.

Just one more confirmation to ask, ask again, and get to know your stuff: I do not have and never had PMI on my loan. During a stressful conversation, the reviewer referred to “insurance” on my account. She could not give me a straight answer to my seemingly simple questions. “What insurance? Who is the insurer?” The “Insurers” the reviewer was referring to is apparently the third party they sold my loan to. Also, I want to say that I have a wonderful real estate agent, who has been positive, kept in constant communication with me, and worked through every obstacle CW has presented to us. I can’t imagine this experience without her guidance and professionalism. Location – Orange County, CA

Now, that I’m thinking about it, it doesn’t make sense that I’d have PMI on a 2nd. However, CW brought something up about insurance during the negotiation process, so I have no idea what that is… I guess I should question that to find out exactly what they’re talking about as it was my realtor that’s been handling everything. At this point, the short sale had to be approved by the insurance company as well and they’ve agreed to it as long as they get the $4k settlement.

Just a little update. I think for us things are moving along I just hope they keep moving. So that you don’t have to backtrack and re-read here’s our story in a nutshell we’re the buyers and the Sellers are only short around 5K. Originally we thought it was just a 2nd with CW but the title paperwork we got shows CW on 1st and 2nd as well as a small tax lien (< 500).

The seller submitted a complete package July 14th (2 weeks after our offer)
We heard a negotiator was assigned July 25th (could have been earlier but this is when we got the news).

We have been told that 3 people have to review the file before it will be approved (fraud prevention measuers) and that it could take up to 30 days.

So that’s 10 business days between truning in the package and having a negotiator. Sounds like that could be a record. We had hoped to close by Aug 29th and while we are prepared that that may be out of the question; if we close sometime in September we’ll be happy

I got an update on our progress today…it’s heart wrenching news but still good because the file is moving. I’ll copy paste the rest of my story as well so you don’t have to read up.
—————————————————–
My first post 7/16:
“Ugh, here we go:
Trying to buy a CW Short Sale, So Cal, Inland Empire area. Offer is $210k, listing was $240k, and outstanding loan is approx $283k
Looked at the house, placed an offer 1/28/08.
Sellers accepted offer the next week.
CW took til April to counter (they didn’t even “officially” counter, they just wrote a memo stating the house was appraised for $230k, if we wanted to up our offer) We remained at $210k (house needs a new roof & A/C & Heating.)
CW “Approved” $210k on 4/28/08

And thats about it? Currently our file has been assigned I’m told by my Escrow Officer (who seems to be the only one in contact with the lender?!?!). She was told 2 weeks ago that the file “would be reviewd by the 4th”. The 4th came & went, and with no update to the file, Escrow officer has an “e-mail in to the supervisor” as of 7/8. She was told not to expect a reply for a week, Called back yesterday 7/15, and was told to try calling back Friday.”
———————————–
My second Post 7/21:
“Hoping for a reply from someone with recent success in closing…
About 10 posts back is my whole story. Here is the latest from our Escrow Officer:
“Fortunately, I now have direct contact with 2 supervisors and they are doing what they can to get the file pushed through, but as I understand more about the process, there numerous steps involved in getting our final approval. I just received an email from a supervisor letting me know that the file has been sent to the analysis team. According to my last conversation with the supervisor, this means that we should have an approval sometime in the last week of July, but that is not a promise.
As far as closing this escrow, the final steps involved are:

*Receive the written short sale approval from Countrywide
*Fund your loan with Countrywide
*Record the sale”

Anyone get to a stage where your file went to “the analysis team”? This is after a negotiator has been sitting on our file for 2-3 weeks. From the steps above anyone know how long from this point it took you to close?

It’s so embarrassing to have people ask why no one in our deal knows what’s going on.”
—————————————————

Last week we were informed the “analysis team” gave us approval, but that our file now had to be reviewed by the “management team”.
And now the latest from Escrow came in today:
“Short sale file was returned from management group to negotiator with their approval. However, file now must be submitted to the two investors backing this loan within three business days (meaning file will be submitted on or before Wed. Aug. 6). Once with the investors, both companies must review the file through their internal channels and grant an approval. This process will take no less than 2 weeks, and can take more than 30 days.
The positive is that the file is moving through the system, but unfortunately we are still weeks from an approval. ”

Anyone got a gun?
I kid, but seriously…this is the most hellish experience of my life.
And every 15 days is now costing us over $250 in points to keep our 5.5% lock in.

My closing is now scheduled for tomorrow. We shall see! I hope that I’ll have some good news to share tomorrow evening.

Hi BJL: It took about 4 weeks for our papers to get through the “investors” stage….hopefully your’s won’t take that long…seems like some people are making headway, so maybe CW is getting more organized. (???) Anyway, hang in there.

I did it! Papers were signed today! YAY for lucky 8-8-08!

Just a few random facts. This was a rental property; CW was the 2nd mortgage holder; the initial loan was taken out in May ’06 for $50k (interest only pmts); CW accepted $4k. The offer was made on Jan. 23rd and the deal was finally completed 6.5 months later. Just a tip to others… The seller needs to call CW directly themselves! They are slow to react, but it seemed to make a difference when I called myself. AND make sure you get the negotiator’s direct extension.

My realtor told me this morning, “We’re all set to close, except we need the approval letter in writing from CW…” He & the title company had been calling CW all week in an attempt to get this letter. I called twice this afternoon and was able to get through to the negotiator on my 2nd attempt. I told her I’m closing in two hours and we need this letter. Her first reaction was to say that wouldn’t be possible, but every excuse she gave, I had a rebuttal. “But we need approval from the insurance co.” Already have that. “But I need to get this approved by upper mgmt.” Ok, then let ME speak to them. “Oh, not possible.” Finally, She said needed an hour to get the paperwork to her mgmt and would get back to me. That was at 2pm EST.

She called me back at 3:40 to say she’d be faxing the letter within the next 20 minutes. Closing was scheduled for 4pm. By the time the papers were signed, the letter was on the fax machine and all was well.

The big joke with my realtor and everyone involved is when someone asks you to do something, just say you’ll get back to them in 3-5 businiess days. Anyone who has called CW will mostly likely find the humor in that. LOL

To BJL… I’m sending you closing soon vibes. CW had to send my file to some insurance co and that went pretty quickly. I’d say a week or less… defintitely not more than 2 weeks, so good luck!

I wish everyone else well with their CW sagas.

I’m not really sure what the impact is going to be on my credit and I’ve been told that it’s going to take awhile for the loans to show up as settled.

Based on the fact that I stopped paying the loans on this property in Nov/Dec of last year, it’s probably going to look a bit better on my credit than what it does at the moment. It’s definitely better than than having a foreclosure on my credit report, which is where I was heading since I could no longer afford the property. It was such a relief to sign the form discharging these loans as foreclosure sounds like such a scary process.

To Sara, Christy, et al: I’m a former mortgage broker with a lot of experience in getting borrowers “credit-ready”. That is to say, I’ve had many clients whom I advised in the craft of cleaning up credit issues in order to get them a mortgage loan at the best possible rate and terms.
Late pays are never good news for your credit score. You can get away with one 30 day late, any more than that and you’d better be prepared with a good explanation. After about five years or so, however, most lenders will look the other way at these provided you have observed good credit management practices since. The most destructive force by far, however, is the dreaded foreclosure. Add one of these to your resumé and the only place you’ll be borrowing money from for the next 8-10 years is the give-a-penny-take-a-penny tray at your local convenience store. Most underwriters consider it to be the pinnacle of poor credit management. And in their defense, you did just screw yourself out of your own home. Relax, I’m not pointing any fingers, just giving you a bird’s eye view of how credit works.
Short sales are something different. While it does indicate some level of mismanagement, it also demonstrates responsibility. You got a little sideways with your creditor, but you worked with them to remedy the issue. Most importantly, in the end, you settled and PAID THEM OFF. The account is closed and you leave oweing the creditor nothing. Depending on how many payments you missed, your credit will still be bruised, but you’ll live to fight(and borrow) another day. For those currently engaged in a short sale transaction, we already know you’re in trouble. The game now is damage control. Follow through, work with the loss mitigation dept. of your lender and sell that house. Don’t sit back and let the bank foreclose. After all is said and done, wait about 60 days and run a credit report to see where you stand. It may not be as grim as you think.

Interesting info on this credit issue. However, I want to point out, that in Florida, we had our home owners insurance TRIPLE in 4 years, which amounted to hundreds of dollars more each month. That’s where the problems started. Then, we had unexpected medical bills and home renovations to pay off. THEN, with the real estate bust, our house was worth far less than we owed. We contacted CW to see what they could do, but they would NOT work with us because at that point, we had NEVER been late on anything. We begged them to work with us, but THEY refused. Renting out our house would not make the mortgage payment either. We had to relocate and sell. Then, after digging I discovered that the ONLY way to QUALIFY for a SHORT SALE was to STOP paying the mortgage. THIS got their attention, and when we found a buyer, they listened to the short sale proposal. After 5 months of waiting, we are due to close at the beginning of September.

I am amazed how CW would not originally work with us, considering our perfect history with them, so in the end, they loose. I think the banks (and not just CW), should help home owners as much as possible in this horrible real estate market that affects many parts of the country. Ideas to solve this housing crisis are to lower interest rates temporarily on individual loans, create reverse mortgages for the time being, forgive unpaid payments and tack the unpaid portion to the back of the note, basically, HELP the homeowners keep things afloat. Florida ALSO needs to get a handle on these ridiculous insurance rate increases (hurricane insurance). This is the best country in the world and we have enough intelligence here to find some solutions. The short sale process shouldn’t take as long as it does either. Many sales are lost and go into foreclosure because of the current process. There ought to be better communication between the banks and the sellers.

I officially propose my own idea of creating a PASS system (Pre Approved Short Sale) and once you have that, the property could be marketed better to potential buyers. Simply have the bank and the seller pre communicate a marketable price, and go from there. Foreclosures hurt everybody and bring down property values. At least short sales help. Anybody else out there like this idea???????????????????????????????????? Anybody know anybody who can implement this idea?????????????????????? Anybody know anybody at CW who will listen? Anybody know any government officials who can implement this with all banks?????????? This is AMERICA…..let’s fix this mess!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

To Hassien – If you can rent your property with a cash flow that is manageable for you, I would recommend talking to a property management company or a realtor who can act as a leasing agent. For a negotiable fee, they can do the marketing, show the property and do the qualifying for you. For the sake of your credit, renting is by far the best solution. In a year or two, we’ll be looking at a different market, at which point, you may want to revisit the idea of selling. On a side note, I think it is a national disgrace that lenders will not make special provisions for military service people. From me, thank you for your service.

To Sara – I want to note once again that I am not pointing any fingers. I understand that one can quickly find themselves in financial distress via medical bills, insurance premium increases and the like through little or no fault of their own. It seems you figured out the answer all on your own. It may not be sufficient to explain your financial woes to your lender. Instead, a small demonstration is necessary. Let me explain. If every American who owns a property which is worth less than they paid for it could call up their lender and say “I’m having serious financial problems, would it be ok if I just short sold the property?”, the entire country would be for sale and lenders everywhere would be devastated(much more so than now). The economic impact would be incalculable.
A short sale means the lender is accepting a pay-off lower than what you owe them. In order to justify taking the loss, the lender has to be convinced it is in their best interest and that you’re not just ‘crying wolf’. Remember, the lender has shareholders and/or depositors to answer to. If you start missing payments, to the peril of your credit, it is perceived that your situation is indeed diar, and thus, is more convincing. Do I advocate skipping a couple payments in order to get out from under a bad investment? ABSOLUTELY NOT! A short sale is a financial parachute – don’t use it unless your plane is really going down. But, if you are truly in trouble, short selling is infinitely superior to a foreclosure or deed-in-lieu(foreclosure-light).

VA Loan Guy

What is the real difference between a short sale and a deed in Lieu. The good the bad the ugly. Give it to me straight no sugar coating I need to know what kind of ride I am going to be on. Thanks.

To VA Loan Guy: Thank you for your excellent posts. All very well said.

To everyone else: I promise to come back and post once we’ve closed on our short sale. Should be soon.

To VA Loan Guy

Like you said about the renting I went over and over it in my head hundreds of times and loosing lots of sleep trying to figure how I could squeeze by without giving up the american dream of homeownership. I felt like a quitter at first because I have never let anything affect me like this.

I might be on the ropes but Im not beaten. After giving it a second look I see it as blessing in disguise. I think that was the nudge I needed to realize I was in a bad spot and if I dont do something now it is going to be a lot worst later. Pick your battles choose them wisely and know your opposition.

Thanks for the honesty that is exactly what I wanted to hear the basics and broken down Barney style. You answerd all the questions and I like what I read. Lets hope this thing corrects its self in a few years or sooner so no more good people across this country fall victim to this epidemic. I dont need luck anymore Im armed with knowledge now! Thanks again.

Wow. Well, it looks like some people are making progress. I don’t want to get enthusiastic too early, but it sounds like (maybe) we’re moving forward on my short sale. CW asked for my updated financial statement again – apparently requested by the investor. I hope this “Investor” part doesn’t take 4 weeks more. A CW short sale rep told me – “This is a positive thing. If they were going to deny the short sale, this is when they could just say no and be done with it. They’re looking at your numbers more closely.” That made sense, and I hope he knows what he’s talking about.
I’d just like to say thank you so much to everyone for sharing their experience – and knowledge. This blog’s been very helpful through this “experience”.

Jessica…..just call CW yourself and ask for the WORKOUT department. Give them your loan numbers and ask for an update on the file. You can call them every single day if you want too. We did. Hope that helps!

Does anyone know that a trustee sale is? From what I understand it goes from a short sale to trustee sale to forclosure. I have a bid on a short sale that is going into a trustee sale early next month. Does anyone know that this means and how long does it stay as a trustee sale before it goes into a forclosure?

IT CLOSED!!! IT CLOSED!!! IT CLOSED !!! IT CLOSED !!! IT CLOSED !!! IT CLOSED !!! IT CLOSED !!! IT CLOSED !!! IT CLOSED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh my goodness….this took 5 full months. Hang in there, and just keep calling them and keep pushing forward. Miracles DO happen. I am going to sleep well tonight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So glad for you both.

It’s looking like ours will probably not close.

Apparently, the “previous loss mitigator” hadn’t noted anywhere in the file that our purchase price best & final offer was 210k (even though we submitted this in writing) and so they (CW and the investor) have been working off a $230k purchase price this entire time, and hadn’t stopped and asked why all the escrow paperwork says 210k til this monday. I was flabbergasted. We’re looking at other homes but haven’t backed out yet…ANYONE else deal with anything like this?

No, we only got verbal approval on the $210k in April. They did not submit any official counter offers, but did write a letter requesting we pay $230k or submit our best & final offer. We wrote a letter back stating our best & final WAS $210k.

Since then they have supposedly been working on giving us a written approval, that’s all we’ve been waiting for!

Late last Friday though, we did get notice that CW and the investor (Guaranty Bank) had submitted the written approval at $210k, we should be back on track to close in the next couple weeks I think?

Yikes! We’re considering putting our rental up for short sale but after reading the feedback (our mortgage is through Countrywide) I’m having doubts it will work out. I’m meeting with the realtor today. Has anyone had a successful ‘short’ sale this way? If so, how should we go about it?

Sara — As a buyer who had been “fed bits of information” for nearly four months, I have to disagree with you. We are adults and can make decisions without being manipulated. Yes, the process takes a long time. But the frustration and disappointment by being lied to about how long it takes has made the process far, far worse. If only we could get a straight answer! Instead, we are told things are progressing, or our calls are not returned, probably because the seller’s agent doesn’t want to tell us that her calls haven’t been returned either and nothing is happening.

I disagree with your advice completely. That mentality is part of what is making people write their horror stories about short sales. Liek we are little children who must be coerced along. Get over yourself.

–Mary

Just letting everyone know that we did finally get our approval from Countrywide & investor Guaranty bank, however, they changed the amount that would go to the 2nd lender, who is now fighting to get some of that $$ back I believe.

Cindy –
You can save yourself time and a lot of grief by following the steps of a short sale in the proper order. Do not count on your realtor to guide you. Many agents purport to be short sale experts, the vast majority are nothing of the sort. It is imperative that YOU be familiar with each step. I recommend the following:
1. Always contact your lender first. Without lender approval, you won’t be short selling anything. There is little point in hiring an agent and getting the carpets cleaned without at least some kind of arrangement in the bag.
2. Hire an appraiser. Yep, you read me right. A realtor will pull some comps and shoot from the hip to try and valuate your property. No good. A competent, certified appraiser will arrive armed with a camera, clipboard and measuring tape to size-up every aspect of the property. They will provide an evaluation of the overall real estate market in the area, statements about issues the appraiser feels are harmful to the property’s value, such as poor access to the property, notations about seriously flawed characteristics, such as a crumbling foundation and an estimate of the average sales time for the property. The appraiser may then use either the comparables method, or the cost method, or even both to determine an accurate fair market value. It is well worth every penny.
3.Contact the lender again with your appraisal in hand and negotiate the minimum purchase price/payoff they will accept. Don’t expect a quick sale at full market value. A modest discount will attract more buyers, particularly if the property is not in ‘turn-key’ condition. Since you will be walking away with nothing but your credit anyway, you have nothing to lose by discounting the price. Be realistic and sell your case to the lender.
4. Now you’re ready for an agent. Interview them like you would interview a nanny. Your good credit is your baby. How many short sales have they done in your area? Then, ask them to define some short sale terms and lingo for you. What does ‘grossing up’ mean? What does a loss mitigator do? Will I have to pay for repairs or offer credits if the buyer’s inspector finds problems? If they stumble or don’t provide the correct answers immediately, politely excuse yourself and move on to the next contestant. I will expound the correct answers in a moment.
5. Contact the lender and grant your agent full access to your account information. This will give him/her the ability to negotiate purchase price and other terms directly on a offer-by-offer basis.
6. As soon as you get an offer, submit it immediately to your lender for approval. Accept all offers, no matter how low-ball. Don’t stop with just one. Some buyers may grow impatient and back out if the deal stalls for a time. Others may, in the meantime, find a property they like better and pull out.You should receive an ‘Approval Letter’ for the winning bid with the buyer’s name, purchase price and financial details. VERBAL APPROVALS DON’T COUNT. See my post dated Sept. 2, 2008. Your lender may ask for a summary of seller closing costs from the title company. You must contact the escrow officer at the selected title office and obtain a copy of the summary. If you delegate this to your agent, make sure he/she follows through promptly by requesting an immediate copy for yourself.
7. Expect a prompt turn-around time. If you don’t get it, make yourself heard. I noted the number to call at CW in my post here on Aug. 27, 2008. Stick to them like super glue and be armed with important dates, such as when the offer was submited to them, when the offer expires and when the COE is. Keep the pressure on and don’t let up.

Here is the answer key to the realtor interview questions:
1. ‘Grossing up’ is the process of adding seller closing costs, inclusive of realtor fees onto the payoff demanded by the lender. Example –
$285k payoff demand
+ $4k seller closing costs
+ $9k realtor fees
= min. $298k purchase price
2. The loss mitigator is a negotiator for the lender who oversees and authorizes the deal. This is the important decision-maker. At some lenders, you may have direct access to this individual. CW is not one of them. You will have to go through the call center.
3. NO. Short sales are always sold as-is. An as-is addendum should accompany all offers submitted for approval from the lender. The addendum states that the property is offered as-is with no warranties. In other words, no credits and no repairs.

If an agent does not seem completely familiar with the answers, he/she is the wrong choice. Be brutally honest, you have a lot at stake here.

It has officially been 6 months that we have been awaiting approval to purchase a home in Katy, TX that is a short sale with CW. We have had to extend our offer several times and have not even made it to the 10 day inspection period. The most recent activity was a request from CW for a revised Hud-1 from the seller’s agent.
We cannot seem to get approval from the seller’s agent to speak with CW ourselves, and he says that his goal is to get us closed within the next 30 days. How is this possible if we’ve been waiting this long with nothing?
I was told by a mortgage broker that even by CW standards that 6 months is excessive for us to wait, and he thinks that maybe the seller is holding us up because they’ve been living in the house for free this long, and maybe they have no where to go at this point. Could this be the case?
Any comments/suggestions would be helpful. Can I call CW and do anything without the seller’s approval?
How is it that others are closing in less time than us? FYI -CW is the only lein holder and they only stand to lose $20k is they take our offer. The seller’s agent claims to call every week.
Tjoy

Hi, I am a buyer who has bid on a short sale, a first home for my husband and I. I must say this process has been very stressful for all parties, to say the least. I will say that in our situation, our agent has been working directly with the seller’s agent (who specializes in short sales) and that communication along with reading this website is what has kept my husband and I staying in there with our bid. It has been a breather just know that we are not the only ones in this situation and a lot of what has been shared on this site is information that has been explained to us by our agent as well. I have even been able to take from this and ask him additional questions, too. We are at a 4 month mark, but communication is really going well and it sounds like we could be looking at closing within a month at this point. Good luck to all of you out there. Keep the communication open and honest, it is always the best policy!!!!! Thanks!

Sara,
I am the buyer and am glad I saw what you wrote….I have been waiting for 3 weeks for my approval letter in writing. I received a verbal Aug 23 and still haven’t received it. I am sick to my stomach. I need to close by October 10 or I lose my loan. Thank you for the reassurance.

Shelly,

After verbal approval it took CW 4 months give or take to get us an approval in writing. Make sure the seller’s agent is calling them EVERY DAY for updates. We put in our offer 1/31/08, got verbal approval end of April, and just got written approval 8/29/08.

I’m pretty sickened too! Thanks for sending good closing vibes our way though

Right now it’s actually in HSBC’s hands, they’re the 2nd lender on this transaction, and they approved (in writing in April) $210k if they get $3k out of it. CW’s 8/29/08 approval letter decreased that amount to $1k. Our realtor and the seller’s realtor are splitting the diff, and paying $1k each out of their commissions to make HSBC happy and get the written from them. And yet…that was 3 days ago our realtors did this and NO UPDATES.
I feel like ripping out my hair.

To Va Loan Guy;
I have another one for you! Well my home is up for short sale now. I currently have to offers on the table. The first offer the buyer is requesting that the seller credit 4000 towards closing costs, HOA transfer fee and home warranty not exceeding 360.00. Second offer buyer is requesting seller credit 5000 towards closing, home warranty not to exceed 360.00 with A/C and termite inspection.

The house is in great condition built in 2006 and occupied less than 2 years.

I have expressed to my realtor that I am not willing to pay out of my pocket considering the hit I am already taking and the house already on the market for pennies. I asked my realtor if it is required that I pay for those things or is it just something that the buyer would like for me to pay for instead of them footing the bill themselves.

My realtor told me because it is a short sale her experinces are that the bank has been footing the bill on closing costs and all those little extras. I dont want to agree to any counter offer with my signature and have to pay thousands of dollars because I got the wrong info and the realtor was just trying to move another property. I have to let go of my house but I dont feel that I have to string myself out even more just so they can close on it.

What should I tell my realtor? Or should I start looking for a new one? I need a realtor that has my best interest in mind.

To VA Loan Guy….

What about me??

To Pamela –

OK. Let’s take this step by step. Do I understand correctly that you made an arrangement with a birddog to purchase a property via short sale? (‘Birddog’ is an industry term for someone who locates and puts a contract on heavily discounted properties, then either sells the contract itself — an assignment — or sells the property to another buyer in a simultaneous or near-simultaneous closing — a double escrow.) Then the property went through a trustee sale, correct? Do you know for sure whether the birddog has a current contract on the property? What does the listing agent say about accepting offers? What is the property’s status on MLS? What type of financing did you secure that would allow someone else to use it without your name being on the title?

We’ll need to get the complete picture before we can put forth a plan. I see some immediate problems that concern me here. Report back and I’ll do what I can to help you.

To Pamela –

Here is one immediate issue that concerns me. A few years back, HUD began a policy forcing lenders to impose a ‘seasoning clause’ on all HUD, FHA and VA loans. In essence, this means that mortgages of the afore mentioned types cannot be granted on a property that has not been owned for at least a year. HUD did this to curb fraudulent activity by some unscrupulous investors and protect the borrowers. Sometimes the seasoning clause can be waived. Make sure you have such a waiver if you wish to move forward with the deal. The ‘sandwich L/O’ used to be reliable technique for negating the seasoning issue, but lenders are now tightening the belt on that as well.

Second, not every state has laws that are double escrow friendly. Make sure you consult with a competent real estate attorney in your area, if you have not already done so.

To answer your original question, CW and the birddog have a solid contract based on the information you have provided. Unless the birddog is in breach of contract and defaults, you cannot simply under-cut her and go straight to CW.

The double escrow is a potent technique for building wealth without having much cash or credit. However, despite the merits extolled by the late-night tv real estate gurus, such transactions require specialized knowledge to successfully execute. Even as the end buyer, you should understand the mechanics of the deal before signing on.

Hi Cindy,
With our deal, we just started lowering our house price $5,000.00 a WEEK until we got somebody in there with an offer!!! Then, we submitted the offer to CW. It was THEN that CW did their own appraisal (they never did tell us what it came in at), and THEN we got the approval for the short. And YES…CW takes out ALL expenses from the sale price including the real estate commission. Our taxes were up to date, so that wasn’t a problem. At closing we had to come up with NADA, ZERO, NELCH, NOTHING… however you want to put it. We also did NOT have to sign a promissory note for the short amount. Nor do we pay taxes on that short since our house was our homestead and not an investment. When the offer is submitted, you have to also submit a cry letter and a hud statement and prof of income and maybe a few other things…things that your realtor will let you know about. Then…you just wait…and wait… and wait….and wait….. and you make calls, and wait…. and you’re told a few hundred different things…. then they change your negotiator on you a few more times, and you wait some more… and then after waiting some more, you wait a little bit more, then after one more call you get an approval. Verbal. Then you get it in writing. THEN your buyer gets THEIR appraisal done for the loan they need and you loose sleep because you think it won’t appraise…but it usually does, because your market NEEDS the sale to help other houses. Then you close. That whole thing took us from start to finish right at 5 full months.

Thanks VA Loan Guy. You’re a wealth of information

Va Loan Guy and Hghlndr

Thanks for the info once again. I knew something didnt sound right from the gouge my realtor was giving me. I attached my latest correspondence with my realtor, tell what you think. It just seems that I have to pull teeth to try to get my realtor to do things that I want. Or am I just being unreasonable on my requests. All I did was change the names on the email to protect the innocent.

Good Morning REALTOR, this is what I need to happen. On the two counter offers somethings have to be changed. Omit all items that state that I the seller will credit any monies towards closing, home warranties/ AC, home inspections termite inspections etc. ( reminder that this home has been under pest control maintenance for the better of a year and a half with no infestation problems and it is current to this date and all appliances are still under warranty the stove is brand new not even three months old). I also need to know if I signed an as-is addendum? If I did I need the most current copy.

Leave the price at 163,000 for the counter offfers. Short Sale addendums need to reflect the same as above where applicable.

This is my realtors response:

Hassien,

I do understand your concerns in the phrase that says” seller will pay”, but according to the contract, there are only 2 people that are involved in the transaction(buyer & seller). In any short sale case, the seller as we all know is deficient in the loan pay off so the bank is the one that will be taking a loss for any items that are stated in the contract subject to bank approval. I guess I could cut the costs down for the bank by eliminating some costs like termite inspection($85) and home warranty($360), but these are items in the contract that are important to a buyer when they are purchasing a resale home and even small fees like these could kill the deal for us.
What I would recommend that you do is to call the banks(perferably the 1st since they are in 1st position to get the most out of the short sale) and ask them questions about these fees and who is paying for them in the case of a short sale. I think I have also encourage you to contact an accountant to see if there are any tax consequences for a short sale. Please do these and get back to me as soon as possible in case if I need to revised the counters.

I know that we have passed our time frame to respond to the buyers and I will also need to call them to see if they are still interested in waiting while we decide.

(I feel like my realtor is trying to get me to agree to just about anything and move on to the next thing).

Hassien –

I’ll be candid. If it were me, I’d show the agent to the door. But, I have an especially strict no-nonsense approach and take no humor of so-called real estate professionals who don’t know their business. Having noted that, I want to correct a couple of misstatements. Lenders — like CW, for example — don’t just pony up for any expenses your agent feels like throwing into the contract. Their objective is to recover as much of the outstanding loan balance as possible with a minimum of closing costs. Be assured, ‘little extras’ will not be met with enthusiasm. Next, as mentioned previously, any buyer can obtain a home warranty on their own. The seller need not purchase one for them. If you already have warranties which are transferable, any sensible buyer should be delighted. In addition, if you can produce receipts to show that the property has had regular pest control service, that should satisfy any reasonable person without the need for any further inspections. If it doesn’t, let them pay for it. For your protection, insist on both addendums.

Keep in mind, many agents got into the business when the market was exploding. They’ve never seen hard times in real estate and they aren’t familiar with the ROE for the times. The rule is ‘seller beware’ every bit as much as ‘buyer beware’.

DK -

Thank you for your kind appraisal. Real estate and creative finance are my passion and I have made a good living from it. In times like this, I feel a sense of duty to give something back and I thoroughly enjoy doing so.

All short sale sellers –

Hghlndr is wise in the ways of taxes. Take heed of his suggestion to seek counsel from a competent CPA regarding the tax consequences of a short sale.

Shelly -

Based on the information you provided in your previous post, I’d say Sept. 19th can’t come soon enough. I can certainly understand your frustration and you don’t have to read very far on this thread to see that you’re in good company.

I would like to point out that despite the recent prevalence of short sales, they have always been a bit tricky and have required specialized knowledge and patience to successfully transact. In the past, they were the near-exclusive domain of seasoned investors who know the ropes and have the resources to roll with the punches. Now, many novice and first-time buyers are getting into the act. That’s great. I’m happy to see the crisis begin healing itself. However, many novice realtors are also on the case and as Debt Kid and others have expressed, the short sale is unlike any other type of residential real estate deal — ask plenty of questions before jumping in.

Shelly,
I really feel for you.
Have you been able to address compensation for the hardware and equipment stripped from the house? If you have access to the property, have you documented the current status with photos? It seems that you should have some recourse there, since you are dealing in earnest and “good faith”. Do I understand your loan is with CW? Can you call them and approach things from that end – as a customer?

VA Guy – You’re awesome, but I finally found one thing to point out where you’re wrong. I’m not a gentleman. I’m a single mom who was sickened by realizing I’d have to go through the short sale process, so I set out to do it as well as I could.

I wish this discussion had been available to me from the first steps of this experience. It’s incredibly supportive and informative.

Hi, Everyone

My name is Tristain and I am Currently a customer of cw I just started the process of giong through foreclosure my home is vakeued at 123,000 I owe 105,000 I found a short sale realtor but I have missed four payments and recieved a letter from the foreclosure lawyer. I just want to get away from this house I do’nt want to make money off the sale I just need to relocate bad since I finally found a job but in another state. What should I do to speed up the process I really need to have this complete by Nov. 15th. any suggestions from anyone please.

Tristain -

At first glance, I have to ask why you are trying to short sell a property that is worth $18k more than you owe? If I have the facts straight, you should be able to sell at around $116k and cover your payoff and closing costs, walking away with nothing gained and nothing lost.

Short sales aren’t quick! I don’t know who would have told you that…

Okay – here is a real CW nightmare. Almost 3 months ago we found a great little house we fell in love with. The listing price was $399k. We put in an offer at full price. We were told that because it was a short sale we won’t hear anything for about 2 months. The next day, our offer was countered by CW at $403k. We accepted and seemed like we were moving forward due to a great selling agent and a really on the ball negotiator. We got the inspection and were just waiting for the written acceptance before moving onto the appraisal. We were promised the written in a week and escrow was opened. CW cashed our good faith check of $5,000…. and then nothing. As we approached the middle of escrow we found out that the second who had agreed to $3,000 was sold to AIG. AIG said they wanted $10,000 and eventually went down to $5k. Escrow was suppose to close several weeks ago, apparently it has been extended. And now, nothing. We have been told for the past 3 weeks we will be getting the written acceptance any day. This has been agonizing for us. If we didn’t feel that this home was so perfect for us, we would walk away. But walking away probably means starting this nightmare all over again with another short sale.

Here is the question. We are just the buyers, but do we have any right to call or write to CW to try to get this moving along. I believe the selling agent has been contacting them regularly, but we want to have more control in this process and at least feel like we are doing something. Our agent is also great, but all she can do is call the selling agent every few days.

Can we request the selling agent put in a letter of authorization for information disclosure?

Thanks for any advice.

Hopeful Buyers,
Good luck with getting authorization. It is just a LONG process…know you are not alone. I have been patiently waiting since May. Good luck to you. Hopefully we will all have beautiful homes when we are done with this. This is not fun!

Hghlndr makes a number of good points.

A short sale is rarely a slam dunk for either party. But, as a buyer, if you’re willing to play the game and be flexible, there are plenty of heavily discounted properties to choose from in just about every community. Personally, I enjoy the satisfaction of having helped someone save their credit and get out from under the crushing weight of their mortgage. As a buyer, you are also helping to reverse this economic melee and restore the market. It’s a win/win in my estimation. Just be patient!

As a seller, your education on the subject and your proactive, persistent approach are your best assets. Ms. Hghlndr’s estimate of the CW negotiators’ work load is pretty close according to a CW insider I know. The fact is, lenders are motivated. They are also swamped with a tremendous backlog of homes in foreclosure. Be diligent and keep calling until you get the desired results.

Above all, I want to reiterate; get it in writing. One poster after another has complained about deals falling through at the last minute. In reality, most never really had a deal because they did not have the all-important approval letter — the holy grail of the short sale. As a buyer, I wouldn’t dream of spending a dime on appraisals or inspections without this valuable letter in hand. And neither should you. As a seller, you should never stop taking offers. Many have written of getting approval, only to find that their buyer has taken a powder. If you had a fistful of back-up offers, you’d likely still be in business. As Yogi Berra once observed, “it ain’t over ’til it’s over”.

It’s good to see so many of you closing deals and moving on. Good luck to all.

Hey guys just thought I would give an update. Today I got furious when once again I was given NO NEWS. We (my realtor and I) went and talked to the broker and she had us call the title company to find out when the last HUD was sent….come to find out Escrow was cancelled last week and I was never informed as well as the listing agent. What the heck? Now it looks like after all the sleepless nights I have NO house. I am so disappointed. I would not recommend doing short sales. The money you can save is not worth the trouble…..Now after all that the listing agent is concerned… I think they cancelled it because my loan was with the Nehemiah program….if only the agent would have done her job 6 weeks ago I could have closed already and had a house and saved someone from foreclosure.

Shelly -

I’m sorry to hear that your deal didn’t go. Although much work was lost, valuable experience was gained. You will be better prepared for the next one that comes along.

You may be right about the cause. DPA programs like Nehemia and AmeriDream present outstanding opportunities to purchase a home without the daunting task of coughing up a full 10-20% cash down payment. Coupled with FHA programs, DPAs are a potent tool for many who could not otherwise buy a home.

As DPAs are generally non-profit organizations, the problem arises when, often, they require the seller to write a check. Inasmuch as short sale sellers frequently suffer from cash flow issues, there is an immediately obvious problem with the combination. Sometimes, there are ways to work around the conflict, but I can envision the listing agent rolling his/her eyes at the prospect. DPAs also do not lend themselves well to the flexible and uncertain nature of short sales. They just add an extra level of difficulty and deadlines to an already challenging transaction. For that reason, I would not recommend the use of DPA programs with short sales or even REOs.

Be advised, the Congress and Senate have passed legislation which was signed by President Bush eliminating non-profit down payment assistance programs effective September 30, 2008. This elimination of private DPAs was packaged by Representatives within the foreclosure bailout legislation.

Cherise,

We are in a similar situation and our Buyer Agent tells us that if we decide to back out at this point then we DO get our deposit check back. I believe it has to do with what is written in the contract… but basically because the offer has expired (i.e. deadlines in purchase agreement not met by the seller), the earnest money goes back to the buyer.

I am not an expert at all and your Realtor should probably be able to better answer this question, but I am pretty sure you are fine. You should be able to get the deposit back.

I live/own a home in Detroit 4 yrs. ago. Because the home is bordering a suburb, the neighborhood was generally good 4 yrs. ago when I bought the house. Now, virtually all my neighors have foreclosed and their empty houses are currently on the market for $60-$70K less that what I currently owe to Countrywide. I want to get out of this house. I am current on my loan, but the neighborhood is getting really bad. There is no way I would be able to sell for the balance owed and I cannot foreclose because I need to maintain my security clearance for work. What are my options?

highlndr -

A lot depends on your local market in terms of recovery. While some local economies are still strong with thriving core industries, others continue to struggle and lag.

It’s great that you have so many offers. Make sure all prospective buyers understand that they are bidding on a short sale and that it may be a lengthy, arduous process. Be frank with them about your experience with CW. If they aren’t up for the ride, don’t turn down more offers.

Your consultant is correct. Well advised, affluent types are scrambling to spread their cash around in an effort to avoid putting too many eggs in an under-insured basket. While precious metals have been a traditional ‘go-to’, many will take advantage of market lows to buy into other investment vehicles. Real estate, despite recent events, is still one of the most dependable investments around. Obviously, I’m a believer.

Historically, short sales have been the jurisdiction of seasoned investors. I honestly don’t recommend them for first-time buyers. They are simply too complex, precarious and require advanced knowledge to execute. There is little room for emotional attachment in such deals — don’t go picking out carpet and drapes before the close of escrow. There are plenty of discounted properties on the market other than short sales for the first-timer. As a novice, the stress just outweighs the benefits, in my estimation.

Anya -

Do you want to get out or need to get out? If you need to get out, see my post on this thread from 8/15 for a breakdown of the options. If you don’t really need to get out, I would recommend sitting tight until the market improves.

Hassien -

You won’t get stuck, as long as you have the short sale addendum with every offer. Your realtor isn’t being realistic in expecting CW to ante up for inspections or extras. She can take a run at it, but my hunch is they won’t go for it. Expect CW to decline or counter-offer. Setting the bar a little lower assures approval the first time around with a minimum of negotiating. Counter-offers mean more time and a greater risk that the buyer will lose interest and walk.

Cherise and Meiks -

Your agent should be able to properly advise you as to the status of your contract. If the seller (or their lender) has not performed in accordance with the contract terms, you are free to pursue the remedies therein, usually up to and including cancellation with a refund of earnest deposits.

@ Alicia -

It is pretty bold of the seller to give you early possession. I trust there some provision for liability in the agreement.
My first suggestion would be to contact the listing agent and demand a more specific status report. The seller has access to a CW website featuring up-to-date status. See highlndr’s post on this thread from 9/22 for an example of the typical information. Have the listing agent send you a screenshot or a cut-and-paste accounting of the info. Whatever activity has taken place on the short sale, it will be so noted on that website. Second, ignore anyone who tells you that you cannot contact CW yourself to prod them. You most certainly can. If the listing agent gets fussy and starts complaining about protocol, you may remind them that they do not get paid until the deal closes, IF it closes. So, it is in their interest as well to play along. The number to call is 866-880-1232. See the last paragraph of my post on this thread from 8/27 for more details. Make sure that you request ‘escalation’. That is a magic buzzword at CW which will kick your case up to a supervisor for review.

@ Alicia –

It looks like you’re on the right track. Five months or so seems to be the typical time frame for CW short sales. This thread is laden with examples.

I would add that if there is anything even slightly out of the ordinary about the contract, CW will balk and reject it. They aren’t the brightest bulbs in the house and will likely be confounded by any manner of creative deal. Keep it simple and be persistent.

Here is general info available to homeowners on the CW site. I thought this might be helpful for anyone interested to see the outlines on these two options.

Deed-in-Lieu of Foreclosure*
You may be able to deed the property to the lender/servicer and avoid a lengthy foreclosure.
You may be able to deed the property to the lender/servicer and avoid a lengthy foreclosure**. For information on how this will affect your credit rating, please consult an independent tax advisor. This option relays to the credit bureau that the financial situation was mitigated. If approved, the Deed-in-Lieu documents are forwarded to our attorney’s office to complete the process.
Required Documents:
o Updated financial information for all parties on the loan
o Interior appraisal
o Title Reports, to ensure that the property is free and clear of any liens or encumbrances, and the premises are vacated
Completed Deed-in-Lieu documents
Estimated Timing
The process typically takes 75 to 90 days to complete, but may take longer. The primary stages are:
o Review of financial information – 2-5 days
o Determination of clear title and value – 2-3 weeks
o Transaction approval – 25-30 days
o Document Preparation – 2-5 days
Document Signing – 1 week

Short Sale*
You may be able to sell your property at its fair market value even if the sale’s proceeds are less than what is owed on your loan**. How the process works:
This option provides you with an opportunity to sell your home quickly, while attempting to preserve your credit rating. At the close of escrow, if the short sale is approved, the proceeds are wired to us.
Documents that are required
o Updated financial information for all parties on the loan
o Completed short sale documents (i.e. Purchase Agreement, HUD Documents etc.)
o Verification of income
o Interior appraisal
Estimated Timing
The short sale process typically takes 60 days to complete, but may take longer.
The primary stages are:
o Determination of value – 2 weeks
o Negotiation and approval of offer – 2-5 days
o Transaction approval – 2-5 days
o Escrow closing – 2-4 weeks

* All plan options may require investor/insurer approval. All time durations listed are estimates only.
** This option may have tax implications. Please check with a financial or tax advisor.

Own an investment condo in Orlando. Husband has hardly any work in last 2 years, my business lost 2/3 of income due to economy…. we’ve had to move out of our primary residence and rent it out to help pay mortgage we can’t afford…we’re living at my parents (how humiliating at 50). Condo is vacant – been advertising on Craigslist to sell since January with hardly any response. 11 units on market… last sale was over 12 months ago at 119k. There are now units selling at 70k with no takers. We have negative am loan, which means debt is increasing and any rent can’t pay for full minimal payment, HOA and taxes. Put in CW request for deed-in-lieu (and I’d still lose $45k as we paid off the high 2nd) and THEY REJECTED IT??!! Said we should do short sale even though I told them there’s been no sales for over 12 months, even at 70k (I bought our unit at $140k).

1. SUGGESTIONS?
2. LET THEM FORECLOSE? With all those attorney fees/late charges incurred on their end, will they collect from me and will I have to declare bankruptcy? I have other rental properties barely making it so there’s a lot at stake.
3. SHOULD I RENT AT CHEAP RENT TO GET SOME INCOME since I’m losing so much already to cover HOA fees, insurance and taxes?… and wait for them to foreclose at meantime?

HELP!!!

Stunting,
You can apply now for the short sale approval to CW, even before you get offers. As soon as I started working with my excellent agent, we started the short sale application process before we even received our first offer. This lets potential buyers and CW know you are trying to sell it as a short sale. This is a proactive move, and CW should note your account as “financial hardship processing” on their files becasue of this. It seems CW’s current focus is for customers to exhaust the “homeowner assistance” programs they are offering. Whether it’s successful or not, you’ve played the game.
Please know that as a short sale, any offers you get may be lower than your asking price, anyway. Even if there are no current sales in your area, you might be inviting offers simply because it is noted as a short sale.
As for dealing with CW, they are absolutely overwhelmed. Keep all of your necessary documents together, and be prepared for CW to “lose” a few doc’s at the beginning of the process, so you may have to re-submit them. Check your account online, and call them to get your file into their focus and keep it there – every step of the way.
Also, you might want to consult a local tax professional, because that may influence your decisions, or at least accurately inform you of what to expect.
Good luck – There’s so much to learn in this process. You really have to become your own best advocate, as a seller and as a CW customer.

Here’s my situation-
I’m looking at potentially doing a short sale on our home, and I have really appreciated these posts to get me up-to-speed on the process.

About two years ago, we bought our first home for $250K, with a $237K mortgage. However, I just accepted a job that will now require us to move at the worst possible time. But the job really is a good opportunity and I’ll be making a lot more $. Our home is currently valued at $215K according to our realtor. That would mean we’d end up owing probably $20K if, and that’s a big IF we can even sell it at that price. I called CountryWide to see if there was any assistance they could provide me. My wife and I both have good credit and we’re up to date on our mortgage payments. We don’t have a lot of debt, however, I have been diligently paying off my student loans during the last three years. The broker encouraged me to contact their home assistance program, which I did. I provided them with all of our financial information and at the end, she said I was ‘approved for a short sale’.

I’m not quite sure was this means, and I’m still not convinced we’ll even qualify given that I currently make $73K and my new job is at $100K. We’ve looked at renting, however, the difference between the mortgage and rent is $700/month.

So, my question is, given our situation, how likely do you think they’d actually approve a short sale for us? If we don’t have a chance, then I won’t even try to go for it even though we’re ‘approved’. Thanks for your help.

I have a question to those of you who have already gotten a ‘short sale’ approval just by calling CW on the phone. Most of you say your payment history is perfect with them, and so does this mean they are going to pre approve you guys while you still maintain a perfect payment history with them?????????? I am so happy for you if this is so. When I called them with my perfect payment history, they wouldn’t talk to us at all. So, we had to stop paying them to get their attention, then get the offer, then submit it, and then got the deal done. It looks like CW is starting to help the home owner’s more than when I went through this process months ago. Our credit has a blemish on it now that we had to stop paying for about 5 months. In fact, we closed in late August and are STILL getting payment invoices!!! We called them, and were told it takes a few months for everything to clear the system. Talk about inefficiency….my word.

Thanks Hghindr. I read through your October 10th posting as well as the posting by VA LoanGuy, which were both very helpful. We’ll see where this takes us- wish us luck!

@ Rusty -

Your situation is like many others where a job, divorce or other life change dictates the need to liquidate a property quickly. Since you’ve studied up here on our thread, you’re likely aware of the credit penalty associated with short sales. I trust that you’ve duly analysed the increased salary vs. credit damage equation. It will take about three to five years to really shake off that damage and restore your good credit. Some folks here are $100k or more upside down on their mortgage. For them, the short sale solution is a virtual no-brainer. In your case, I think it’s a tough call.

One seller I know of, who was in a similar situation, threw in his collectible Ford Mustang to sweeten the deal and get a few dollars more for his property. He ended up with what he needed to pay off his loan in full without short selling — an unconventional, but effective strategy.

@ sara -

A couple of months ago, I noted that times were changing over at CW, as they are now under the B of A umbrella. I have been advised by a CW insider that there has been no real integration in the short sale divisions of the two entities to date, but the mission has changed. Where the modus operandi was to sit on short sales, the new mandate is to aggressively pursue and liquidate defaulting notes before they become REOs. Your comments highlight the new attitude. Good news for all.

@ Mary Ann -

You are certainly a prime candidate for a short sale.

To answer your questions, a PMI policy will make a short sale no more or less palatable to the lender. Our goal is to avoid foreclosure. So, any consideration of PMI coverage in that circumstance is purely academic, as far as we’re concerned.

Step one is, as hghlndr suggests, to contact CW and get the dialogue and paperwork started. See my post on this thread from 9/8 for a recommended step-by-step strategy.

Need advice please. We are in the process of trying to purchase a short sale, Countrywide holds the first. I am in California. There is also a second. The home was listed for 425K, made an offer of $399 and placed $1000 earnest money, which my understanding they accepted. This was in the beginning of July. Our realtor called the following week stating that we had a verbal approval of our offer from CW. He said he was told to put the house in escrow. Well, now three months later we are now being told that the appraisal came in to high and they cannot accept our offer. The appraisal was done in JULY! Over the last three months we have been told again and again that we would close in two to three weeks. We are being told that our file was lost by CW for over a month (Sept).

Can they do this now? They have had the appraisal and offer for since July. We feel like we have been led on for months. We are not sure if we are getting the full story from our Realtor or if the problem truely all lies with CW. Our Realtor thinks the appriaser is crazy. He had contacted the negoiator at CW who said last week that he would have the appriasal re-evaluated. We would have an answer in 48 hours. It has now been a week and no answer.

What options do we have>>>>Should we contact CW directly?

Thank you in advance!

Highlnder: How involved is the seller and the seller’s agent in communications to CW?
Reflection: I don’t know the answer to this. My agent is also the sellers agent

Highlnder: What do you have on your side to encourage CW to get them to talk to you directly?
Reflection: I would say the ability to a home off their hands that the seller hasn’t made a payment on in a year

Highlnder: Are you financing with them?
Reflection: NO! We have a friend that has their mortgage through them. She has automatic payments. Well, they took SIX payments last month!!

I have recieved advice to have my Mortgage Lender contact CW as “they speak the same language”.

My big question is can they take and cash the earnest money and then just plain reject the deal …they didn’t even counteroffer.

Thanks for you help!

Va Loan Guy – You are so right…get the approval letter! We have been trying to get this since July. First we were told that they were awaiting the appraisal. Then it was waiting for a negotiator to be assigned.

Also, get this…when you call the short sale department if they are busy your transferred to the work out department and never told. Thus when our Realtor called and was on several occasions told that a negotiator was assigned and even given a name, which would never return his calls. He was also told that the purchase was approved. Turns out the negotiator was the one for the work out department. So NOW we have a Negotiator in the short sale department…three months later.

So yes we have been trying to get it in writing. Just no luck.

You also gave really good advice concerning not paying for inspections, appraisals etc. until you have the approval letter. Wish we had this advice given to us!!

Ok so I am going to try and clarify my questions.

1. Are there any regulations in regards to time frames…i.e. Time limit for a negotiator to be assigned?
2. Time limit from time appraisal received to rejection/approval of offer (I think 90 days after appraisal is a LONG time to reject)?

What I am looking for is a way to push this deal forward and if they have the right to reject an offer after it has been on the table for 90 days after the receipt of the appraisal. I could see the deal falling through for other reasons, i.e. second not cooperating etc. But not due to the appraisal when they had it in their hands for 90 days!

We don’t want to back out. We really want this property. We just need this happen NOW….We relocated for work and have been living in a trailer for 3 months waiting for this deal to go through. Pretty tight quarters for two adults, two teenagers, to BIG dogs…and I won’t say how many cats.

Thanks!

THANKS!!! I won’t copy it word for word, but I do like some of the language you use. It is greatly appreciated. The thing the just ticks me off is that they had the appraisal for 90 days and NEW that they would be rejecting the offer. To me that is just unacceptable.

Hey there… I posted here awhile nack when I was selling a rental property that was financed through CW… Now, I’m selling my (previously) primary residence – also a short sale… I know this is mostly about CW, but hoping to get some advice.

Today, my bank (not CW) sent an approval letter – good news right… yea, not so much, BECAUSE I have two offers on the table. There is a difference of $5k btwn the offers and the higher off has NO inspection requirement. They approved the LOWER offer that requires an inspection.

I swear these banks are their own worst enemies. It seems to be common sense to approve the higher offer with NO further requirements… AND that buyer chose to do the inspection in advance of making the offer knowing their offer was higher, so it totally sucks for them that the bank did this, not to mention that the bank is losing out on $5k, which is pennies to a bank, but when you keep losing pennies, it adds up… and I fear… what happens if this other buyer does an inspection and chooses to back out??? and I lose the other buyer? PERFECT.

I’m a lil aggrevated right now. I just found out about this tonight and I’m planning on calling the bank in the morning, but I’m assuming that the buyer has been notified and things are moving forward.

Any thoughts?

VA Loan Guy -
Thank you for your reply. I realize that I have nothing to gain regardless of which offer that the bank accepts — EXCEPT avoiding foreclosure. My gripe is that by the bank accepting the less solid offer, they are putting me at risk of being faced w/foreclosure as there is no guarantee that the second buyer will stick around – which is why I am angry. It’s simply the difference between the quick and easy sale versus one that may or may not go through.

Best case scenario, this buyer completes the inspection and is satisfied w/the results. I just get nervous about inspections, because the home is 160+ years old, so it’s not perfect, but in my opinion there aren’t any issues that require immediate attention. If people are not cognizant of that, they might get nervous once they see the results of the inspection – I know that it made me think twice when I purchased the property. Strangely enough, this buyer was renting the home when I bought it, so hopefully she is familiar with the flaws and won’t be scared off by the home inspector.

I will continue to sit with baited breath and hope that the sale goes through without a hitch.

@ Meiks -

Q1) Not all ‘Countrywide loans’ are actually owned by Countrywide. Often, the loans are sold on the secondary market in bundles — known as mortgage backed securities — to investors such as the famed Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, amongst others. However, CW may continue to service the loans on the investors’ behalf. Depending on the servicing arrangement with the investor, CW may have limited powers to accept a short sale deal on their behalf as well. In that manner, some of the decision-making power is ‘delegated’ to CW. An inquiry as to the nature of the investor’s servicing arrangement may help clear that up.
Q2) I am not familiar with the mnemonic ‘OSU’ in this context.
Q3) Again, I am not aware of any State which has statutes limiting the time a lender may take to consider a short sale offer. The approval letter is among the final steps in the process for the lender. Once the seller has received it, you’re ready to close.

Hi everyone…I wanted to give everyone an update. I took BJL’s suggestion and wrote a letter to Mr. Lewis, however, I took it a step further and found e-mails for every Executive that I could find for Countrywide. I did this on Wednesday afternoon. I think it is working!

I have not received a response, BUT amazing my Real Estate Agent was contacted by Countrywide’s “Concierge” Short Sale Manager. All of the sudden our offer is fine and they wanted to see what the Second was saying on this so they could wrap up their end and get this closed. They said as long as the Second doesn’t come back and want $20K then we should close within a couple of weeks. I know I have heard this before but at least there is movement again!!

THANK BJL!

@ Reflection:

AWESOME! I’m so glad it seems to be helping! Seeing your post just made my day. If I can help anyone shorten the hell that is the purchase of a CW short sale, I’ll do my best! Good luck!

Good luck to you too highlndr!
I hope that the letter coming from the seller’s side will be as effective, let us know what happens for sure.

I sent an email and a fax to the BofA retention team office today, requesting them to forward along the documentation I have. Maybe a long shot, but their offices are in the same small town I live in.
I sent an email to the legal network I have access to, inquiring about my options for help there. Thanks for the tips on lingo to use – it’s all in my email there.

Amazingly, my misplaced files, inlcuding the selected offer, were found somewhere in the short sale department. Just yesterday they were asking for us to submit a new offer. My agent and I each heard the catch phrase “escalating” during our phone calls to CW today.
I’ll work on more letters and emails, and get those out, too.
I do not want to go through the Christmas season here, waiting for my short sale to finish up!
Thanks for all the support – you guys are great!.

Well here is an update. Two weeks ago the selling agent received a telephone call from CW telling him to tell our agent to move forward. Everything is accepted and they want to close no later than Nov. 8th. But, still no acceptance letter. By the following week we were extremely stressed out. We are doing an FHA and we could not and would not proceed without the letter. FINALLY the next week we got the written acceptance and it says to close no later than Nov. 2. It is completely unbelievable. We have been waiting almost 5 months with promises of the letter every week. We finally get the letter and they give us less than 3 weeks to close. Of course everything is moving very quickly. We got the FHA appraisal yesterday and the loan will be submitted to underwriting Monday. Whether or not we will be able to accomplish this by the 2nd is questionable.
We are very happy to have gotten the letter, but the time limit is very possibly unreasonable. I think we are just relieved to finally have a definite time line.

Hi cg,
My first potential buyer did walk – after 4 months. They were pre-approved with CW, before they even looked at my place. They were perfect on credit reports, and the pre-approval amount was almost 2x the amount of the total sale on my place. It was infuriating to lose them – it should have been a slam dunk. And, it was apparently too good to be true.
When we had to scramble and re-list the property the 2nd week of September, it was quickly obvious we had different potential buyers than the first go-round. The explanation we came up with was some investors had pulled cash out of FDIC insured accounts, and were now considering real estate as a preferred investment. (My condo was offered to this group as a pre-approved short sale since we had approval on the previous sale. So, we knew the sale price and terms deemed acceptable by CW. ) We had several offers written and presented by brokers; and presented three similar offers (highest cash to CW, best financials) to CW for their decision.
We understand they are now focusing on one buyer’s offer we have presented, and we are crazily hoping this buyer doesn’t walk away, as well. We hope we don’t lose so much time that we need to go to the back up offers, but it’s a touhg lesson to learn.
We have presented everything to CW in good faith, in a timely manner and tried to comply with their requests, even when we were sure it was mishandling on their end that caused so much backtracking.
If they drug their feet for over 4 months on a CW pre-approved buyer the first time, what are they looking for that would ensure a prompt and efficiently processed short sale? We pretty much know that doesn’t exist, so we have to work with CW, and their selected operations on that particular day.

@cg,
I live in Southern CA.
The 2nd offer has been in their hands past 30 days; that was Wed., Oct 15. They asked me on Friday to call back in 3 to 5 bus days for the final decision – I told them I’ll call back Tuesday morning.
My agent and/or I do call CW twice a week, and coordinate our efforts to avoid duplicate calling. But, that is being practical and logical, and dealing w CW needs a new set of rules. I check my online workout notes every morning, and send my agent a daily update regarding the progress. She usually calls CW, and she has the most current info have available to me when she calls.
I was furious with CW about last week’s deadline missed, and lost files, etc., so I decided to call them- again, even if it was a duplicate call. So, on Friday, my agent and I both called CW short sale dept. Her call was 55 minutes, and mine was 20 minutes. We found out after we hung up – we were on the phone with the same dept., at the same time!! She was half-done with her call when I reached them. CW didn’t tell either of us, so they were probably not even aware of the duplicate effort.
I sent out some emails to CW exec’s yesterday, and should hear from an attorney this week. It’s been a long 5 months, of trying to be proactive, do everything “right” and repeating steps, but CW is an extreme mess, and very difficult to deal with.
Just a footnote – When I called Friday, I was advised that I am an excellent candidate for, and will be receiving a personalized home retention program packet. The gentleman said – “I realize you want to proceed with your short sale, but I had to tell you that”. Somebody at the top isn’t getting the whole picture. Some people are going to take advantage of this, and it may be a blessing for them – but I think others are going to get into deeper debt; so we’ll see what the market is like in another 6 to 12 months.

Well… I sent VA Loan Guy’s info regarding the CW time line and escalation procedure to the listing agent for our property and asked if she had tried escalating the file. She states that the file has been escalated twice in Sept. But, alas, to no avail because we are still sitting here waiting.

Also, I did find out from her that “file does not have to go to the investors for approval. Countrywide staff has been given the authority to negotiate. ” So basically it is a non-delegated decision, but the listing agent is not so sure that is a good thing.

So not sure exactly what we are waiting for. Just a ANY decision. 4.5 months later for us (the buyer) but it has been 10 months for the seller. No payments since January. Offer in June. Appraisal in July. Then NOD filed in July. Still no foreclosure and still no answer on the short sale… just sitting helplessly in Purgatory.

Just wanted to tell everyone of my appreciation for the information that you’ve all provided.

I have a property for short sale in SoCal. If it were not for the experiences everyone has contributed, I would not have realized how naive I was in thinking everything was going well with the short sale, or how ineffective my realtor has been.

We submitted for a short sale in June of ’08, and it has not proceeded beyond the initial negotiator. My realtor informed me today that it was still under review, and that they have received a BPO that was conducted late September. This same information I received several weeks ago, when I called the customer service line; my realtor was never in contact with the negotiator or anyone working directly with our file. Even worst, the realtor has not been in regular contact with the buyer’s agent; I found out the buyers decided not to buy only after asking my realtor to verify their intentions.

As I continue to push for the short sale, I am better prepared to deal with CW with all of the information you have provided. I also am pushing more on my realtor, whom I have intentions of replacing. I would gladly have my wife sell our place, since she has her real estate license; but according to CW she cannot represent herself in a short sale (it would be a conflict of interests).

Bkfalken —

Find an agent that is a good communicator and has no problems keeping the buyers in the loop all the time. As a buyer, if you are sitting there for a month with no word, then it becomes very tempting to just walk… especially with so many other properties out there right now….

So anyway, even if your agent is getting NOTHING from CW, just keep the buyers informed that you are trying, and calling, and working… and keep them in the loop…

Thanks to all for your posts – it helps to know we are not alone. Here is our saga w/CW . My husband is active duty Navy – just returned from a 1 year tour in Iraq – I have my CA real estate license .(currently not at brokerage as I’m working for stable income due to RE market) We received word of relocation orders to MD in April. After much research with other collegues – was told I could not short sell our home in Eastlake Chula Vista, CA as it’s a conflict of interest. Hired who I thought was an experienced agent to short sell the house. Went on market in April – agent fell off the planet before the ink was dry on the listing agreement – did not return phone calls, no marketing of property etc. After a month of trying – he made contact and I fired him. What seemed like 5 minutes from when listing was taken off MLS – received several “cold calls” of agents who stated they were the masters in short sale. After sorting thru the duds, interviewed 3 agents, selected one who has over 35 yrs r/e experience and done short sales when CA market crashed in late 80′s and said he closed 17 military clients w/CW this year . House went back on market this Keller Williams agent in June. Our lender is CW. This has been a nightmare! We have explained over and over that we are military having to relocate to east coast in October and won’t be able to rent and keep up mortgage. We thought 6 months would be a decent time to sell. We received an offer on July 2. Submitted everything to CW – file sat for 3 weeks and no action – received letter from CW saying they closed our file for missing info and they tried to contact us. They did not contact us at all or agent. I had to call the stupid minimum wage working/don’t give crap short sale dept and explain they were defrauding the US Military. Within 1 day an appraiser came out (August 11). We were told by CW it takes 30 days to review. We called on Sep 12 and negotiator never looked at file – our agent said he was calling CW and buyers agent . We were told by our agent that buyers are willing to wait. We kept calling CW to find out status- calling every other day. Same thing – run around. On Sept 26 a BPO was ordered – it was uploaded in system on Oct 8. We still call agent and CW get run around. On Oct 8 we also found our agent went to a mgmt position and not doing short sales – he never told us. We had to go to the broker of record and was told “oh your file slipped thru the cracks”. We have since had to move to the east coast and yesterday (10/21) we found out the buyer backed out. Just 3 days before we were told they wanted the house- we contacted the buyers agent and she said she hadn’t heard from her client in weeks. Between our agent and CW – we are now in a bind. We’ve begged and pleaded w/CW and explained that we’re military and can’t afford both rent and mortgage. We’ve submitted our hardship letter and financial docs 3 times. We’ve been told that if we’re not in default they won’t help. Default isn’t an option as my husband has to maintain his credit for his security clearance to do his job.
Any insights..?

Nvywhyf

Servicemen Relief….

I would not give up there is help for you out there for you, read this article.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=93638961

Hello all,
Quick update. Well after my CW e-mails things were moving. All we had to do was get the second to agree with a settlement. Well, the second is with CHASE. Now we have been dealing with them is July, too. They have known all along the amount approximate amount they would be getting and seemed ok with it. Well, no surprise but they have came and said they wanted $14K…nowhere near the $3K that was on the table in July. So once again we are hit with a stumbling block. I feel like I am being blackmailed by CHASE. They confirmed that the account has already been written off as a bad debt (The sellers haven’t paid for over a year). So, I would think they would take any amount of a money they could get and run.

Our agent has offered to give up even more of his commission to make the sale go through. But it will still be about $5K short of what Chase wants. Now it is not some much the 5K but the principal. I feel like we have been lead on and batted around for months.

The house is in forclosure and the agent feels that if our deal falls through it will be on the auction block within a couple of months. We could wait until then and get the house for even less, but again …I am just …well I can’t use that language here.

So, I maybe going after Chase to see if they can get their noses out of the skies and back to reality. It really depends on if the loan was a hard loan or a purchase loan.

Anyway, enough venting….Let me know if you all have input on how to go about this next hurdle.

Thanks!

Reflection,
I would definitely go back to chase and ask them what they are smoking? If the house goes on the auction block they may get ZERO…

Nvywhyf,

Your situation is exactly what we were facing a couple of months ago. We owned a house in Otay Ranch, just down the road from your place. We are also a Navy family and received orders to the east coast in March (to leave in June). We immediately put our house on the market as a short sale but CW wasn’t really working with us because we were still making our payments. Long story short we got an offer and a buyer who was willing to hang in there and stopped paying our mortgage in July. It was a hard thing to do but as you know it would get to be impossible to pay rent and the mortgage with a huge difference in BAH. After much calling to CW by us and our wonderful agent we closed our short sale on October 1st. So it can be done.

No great advice to give, except that CW was more willing to move this along after we stopped paying. I know that there is concerns with security clearance issues.

Good luck and hopefully you’ll get another offer.

Hey Carrie,

I am not sure there is anything you can do to make it go faster but you should:
— Carefully read all the documentation here,
— Be educated on the short sale process,
— Make sure you have all of your documents together on your side and submit everything to CW on time
— And constantly stay on top of contacting CW and making sure they have everything they need (they will probably lose everything at least one time).

The more organized you are, the better it will go for you. I would also make sure your agent is well versed in the short sale process: All the normal rules agents are used to are out the window these days. The listing agent is the PRIMARY contact and does the most work in a short sale – so you need someone that knows what they are up against.

2 months is super optimistic. I would bank on more like 4 months from the date the offer is submitted. (We’ve been waiting over 4.5 months thus far). Countrywide is way too overwhelmed with short sales and you will be lucky to even get a negotiator to look at your file in 2 months! Not to be pessimistic, just trying to convey the reality of what you will be up against and the time frame you are looking at!

However, the good news is that it is likely that CW will not foreclose, especially if you have a short sale in the works. CW does not want any more of these properties. In my short sale the sellers have not made payments in 10 months. 2 NODs have been filed, but CW has never foreclosed. You more then likely have time to work on short selling your home before they foreclose… but just be aware that it will take TIME… a lot of it!

Finally, make sure you keep your buyers in the loop! Let the know what is going on and that you are constantly working on getting this deal to go thru. Try and get a feel for if they are still interested in the property… if they walk, you kind of have to start from scratch! So make sure they are solid buyers that are genuinely interested in the property, and willing to hang in there and wait it out.

There is a lot of good information on this site… read thru all the comments… you will see some success stories… IT CAN AND DOES HAPPEN! But it is not a pretty or quick process.

I’ve been working on a Countrywide and B of A short sale since late June. It’s gone smoothly so far thanks to an early offer. Although that buyer walked we got 2 other offers, and we got negotiators and investor approval. Then the next buyer couldn’t qualify and buyer #3 is still interested and waiting. When I call they say it’s in foreclosure yet they asked me to tell my client to call for home retention. I gave the number to my client but I’m worried that if he calls they may no longer want to talk to me or negotiate the short sale. Is this a setup? It’s hard to trust a company that has hurt so many people. Thanks for your responses..:)

Mike
Thanks for the input…good to know we’re not alone aboard the USS CW Stinks. =0)

We are current on our payments too. Who was your agent. To add to the saga yesterday…our agent has decided to pursue a different career, his broker said they are overwhelmed w/short sales and since our buyer backed out – we need to find a new agent and cancelling the listing….so we are back to square one. We are concerned on credit impact if we miss payments, as we would like to buy a house at our new location in a few months (much more affordable cost of living than CA)

However….the debt kid site provides great resources if you ever come into our situation and need another realtor that specializes in short sales.

Keeping a positive attitude is key in all of this to maintain sanity. Hang in there everyone – it will work out.

Carrie,
Be prepared for offers that are lower than your listing price. Is your list price based on short sale comp’s in the area? This is a completely different experience compared to any previous buying and selling properties you may have gone through. And the rules from the past no longer apply because of the volume and bottleneck at CW.
Sign in with your loan # to check your account staus online. There may be detailed notes available to you, that will be to your benefit.
Here’s how to get there in detail: Sign on to CW, it may take up to 10 minutes to create a sign on because there are several security steps to set up on the site. After you sign on – on the 2nd page – under Account Summary, select Acct Information on the right. The next page will pop up – it shows a snapshot of recent payments and current loan balance. On the left – there should be “FINANCIAL HARDSHIP ASSISTANCE” in red. This option appears when the account reaches the short sale/retention option status. Click on that; 2 options appear – WORKOUT NOTES and FINANCIAL HARDSHIP ASSISTANCE. Click on either, and you will get a lot of current info on your account. Any CW customer can access this for their account.
Also, you may want to print out the last month or so worth of posts here and highlight notes that apply to you – these posts can serve very wlll as your guidelines. Sorry to repeat if you already know this, but “Control” and “F” will help find your keywords among the posts.
Good luck, Carrie!

Thank you all for your positive feedback. I just talked to CW…some woman named Shanita…again another agent. It never seems to be the same one so I am keeping a list now. She tokd me that they needed an Outhorization letter and a Hradship letter from me and the P/S agreement form the gaent. I wrote all of it up and sent it off so now its just hurry up and wait I guess. Amazingly enough this time when I called they had acted on mylast call and assigned the account to a rep for a deed in lieu review that I had requested last month so they did eventually act. I am glad I found this site so I am armed with the knowledege I need to deal with these people. Thankfully the people that made the offer on the house already own property and do not need to move into this one right awya they are planning on keeping 2 properties and are prepared to deal with teh CW waiting game. They were going to build on the lot next door as this is a subdivison and found that they could get the same house that theyw ere going to build for a lot less so hopefully this will all go through in time to save our good credit rating. Incedentally my agent told me that not paying the mortgage gives CW incentive to take the short sale…

Hey Carrie… Hghlndr is absolutely right… you don’t need to be concerned with how much lower the offer is then what you owe… You just need to get the offers in there so CW can start assessing them and get the process started… And Sara is a perfect example of a success with similar numbers!!!

To put things in perspective… I live in California where the house prices got really out of whack… The house I put an offer on was listed at $450K for 6 months with no offers… We put an offer of $400K…. Then we came to find out that the sellers actually owe $650K!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CW is looking to take a hit of a quarter million dollars if they accept our offer… but this is NOT UNCOMMON in this area…
My best friend just closed a short sale for $388 where the sellers owed $615 (not a CW loan, but still).

The house I put an offer on is a regular residential home… The kitchen and bathrooms are not even updated (they are all 80′s style, old appliances etc.)… but it is a large house, beautiful exterior, nice yard, and in a good neighborhood etc. …. Still, at one point during the boom in 2006 it was appraised at $829K!!! It is ridiculous that a normal house like this would ever be appraised at that amount… The banks did this to themselves… house prices were rocketing out of control at an unsustainable rate… appraisers were fired if they didn’t come up with the high numbers in their appraisals… and banks were giving out 100% financing to homeless people with no jobs…. so now they are paying the price…

Anyway, let the bank worry about how much of a hit they have to take and you just get those offers in there and start working on your short sale!!!!

Carrie,
Personally, I think you should keep showing it and accept back-up offers. The bottom line is- it’s going to be the strongest offer that gets approved, and that includes the most cash to CW, or the investor; but the interested party must be 1)willing to wait for this slow process, and 2) a qualified buyer.
We had brokers write detailed offers on my place; with inclusions of cash back requests, etc. These buyers were aware that others were also bidding, so there was determination and creativity in these offers. (These were the 2nd group- after the 1st short sale request was approved.) Depending on the motivation and qualifications of the potential buyers, you may receive offers that are not just cut & dry.
We presented 3 strong offers to CW, all with seemingly qualilfied buyers, and considerable down payments. We received some weaker offers that we did not even submit, as they were offering less than the established dollar range.

to Mike: We also closed in late August…first and second with CW with short sale. (not enough to cover the second). ARE YOU STILL GETTING PAYMENT STUB NOTICES FOR THE SECOND? We are. We are told that the second takes a few months to actually disappear from your credit reports…lots of paper channels to go through I guess. The first got dropped off immediately and we got the Satisfaction of Mortgage thing sent to us. Just curious on your end.

My husband and I put and offer on a house in august it has been 11 weeks and cw called my realtor and asked if we were intersted they told her all they needed was an amendum (which we singed that night and fax to cw) and we could close by the end of the month, which is now a week away. I feel like we will never get a singed contract from them, would you wait around for this?

Oh yeah, and did CW by any chance give your realtor that approval in writing or was that your “verbal approval”?

Also, be realistic by taking what you hear from the seller’s agent with a grain of salt. I don’t know the agent, but only a few have much experience with short sales. If they slightly, even slightly – change dates or other info so it’s what they think you want to hear, it can get distorted fast. Ask them to be 100% accurate and up front with you regarding this process. Keep notes, make copies of everything – speak up and be your own best advocate.

@ Carrie,
I’m so glad you checked your account online. Watch that site, as the transactions usually post in a cluster of activity, when someone is actually working on your file. It doesn’t include everything, but it’s a tool.
Unfortunately, I think your agent’s right about your account status. I suggest you contact CW to let them know you’re unable to keep your account current, and ask them to note it. You may have to submit updated financials.
I think I have submitted 4 sets now; including an update last week. I’m frustrated. I am starting from square one again – submitting my personal (short sale qualifying) documents with the latest offer we are presenting to them.
CW notes dates for reference on every step of the short sale process, so you want every one of those dates posted for future reference. I’ve noticed they now actually compare my file’s specific dates noted, to their internally accepted timelines more often.
I am so ready to be done with this, and I know you all are feeling the same.

Wow-I stumbled on this site and can’t believe some of the situations you people dealing with CW are going thru. What a terrible and sad situation all these lenders and bankers have done to the housing market with their greed. The lives they have messed up, not to mention our economy,and for that matter, the global economy. It wasn’t that they made bad or high risk loans…it’s the amount of them that they made that caused all this. Had they done a few, people who could no longer make their mortgages could have sold their homes when they got into trouble with arm resets or whatever, if the housing market was stable. However with the high volume of high risk loans that they made they have destroyed the housing market, thereby ruining their own collateral and making it a nightmare to sell or refinance a home in trouble because of the huge inventories and collapsing prices.
I see a lot of bright and knowledgeable people on this website. I have not been able to get much help or advise on my situation nor do I know where to look to find out. When I saw all these posts here I thought ” gee, with all these people on here experiencing a lot of what I am, maybe someone out there could respond and give me your thoughts on my situation and advise or answer some questions I don’t know. ” So here goes.
I have an 800 credit score. I have no debt except for my mortgage. However I am unemployed and my job prospects here in Las Vegas where unemployment is prolly top 5 in the country is poor. The housing and forclosure market are also amoung the worst nationwide aswell. My first morgage is an interest only
arm with countrywide of 164k due to reset in may. My second is with Wamu 20 yr fixed for 47k. A $211,000
loan for a house that at it’s peak was worth $265,000.
I now have it listed for $149,000. Fair market value! Sheesh. Down $116k from it’s peak, and upside down
currently- $62k. Believe me I know my story is not unique , no sympathy asked for but what would anyone reccomend? Can’t refi even if I found a job-sorry no equity. We all know how helpful Countrywide
is. They won’t even talk about freezing my arm until 120 days before it resets. I could continue to make my payments for at least 6 or 7 months from my savings on the hope that I can get them to negotiate later. I’ll
prolly find a job eventually and could prolly even make my payments even if I have to pay more when my arm resets if they won’t negotiate. My question is why should I? I don’t want to deplete my last cash reserves trying to hold onto a house that will prolly never be worth the money I throw at it unless it is revalued to market value. I don’t want to give them my money until I’m homeless and out of options. These predatory greedy lenders have made it more attractive for me to walk away from my loan than to pay it! I doubt my home will regain $62K in value in the next 5 yrs. Even if it did, I would only be “even”. Right now housing prices are still dropping.
I could rent an apartment or house and pay $500 or more a month less than I am now. @ $500 a month for 5 yrs I would be $30,000 or more ahead in 5 yrs instead of even. So I have the home I love up for sale.
I’m going to quit making payments. CW won’t let me list it as a short sale until I have it listed 90 days. Silly beaurocrats, It’s listed at fair market value and will be a short sale anyway. Seems even if I do get an offer the buyer or seller enters into a nightmare to get CW to respond anyway. Never mind they also have to negotiate with my 2nd. So I have to hope it will go thru as a short sale anyway. Either “with satisfaction” and my debt forgiven, or as a delinquincy. More than likely tho it will prolly end up in foreclosure. Judging from the comments I have read here on how efficent CW is. So they may chose to get a judgment on me.
I am in solvent..I have less assets than debt and they won’t get a dime. Maybe I’ll be forced into bankrupcy.
I’m sure not going to be able to pay them the $62k or more I’m upside down if they find me delinquint or file a judgement after auction. They could try to recover their closing costs and attorny fees etc and run my judgment to $125K. Good luck!
They could save a lot by re-valuing my home for what it is worth and give me a fixed loan at a fair interest rate and make money.. but no. They should call a proctologist to help them get their head out of their butt.
So a few questions for anyone who has made it thru this far of my sad story and rant.
How long usually until I am foreclosed?
If I decide later to make payments to stall foreclosure, can I make just a payment or 2 and be a month or 2 behind, or do I have to pay it all current?
What exactly happens when foreclosure begins?
They pin a default sign on me right? Then what?
An Auction? How long can I live in the house before I
have to move? Is there A forum or something I can go to to talk with people who have been thru foreclosure?
What about this Countrywide settlement that is supposed to happen Dec 1? I can’t find out any particulars..CW isn’t telling. Anyone see any hope for me there? Anyone think I should try to hang on and wait for CW or the government? Anyone see anything I’m missing?
I want to plan for my future after my home loss and I’m not sure how this will unfold if I go to forclosure. I would appreciate any positive input anyone can give.
I am embarassed in a way about having to default if that is what it comes to. I did not get my 800+ credit score stiffing on my debts. I haven’t had a late payment on anything in 20+ years. I did not take out a bad loan I could not repay. I can still pay. I felt if I could not refinance my home or make the payments I could sell it into a stable housing market for what I paid for it at least..even a little less if nessesary. I, and many others were not aware that banks and lending institutions were artificially creating a housing bubble by imprudent and greedy lending practices. I was under the impression that they were still keeping to the practice of only making a small percentage of their portfolio in high risk loans. The volume that they did is what has made the economy into the mess it is today and I won’t feel bad defaulting on them. It’s like giving me a car loan and then destroying the car and expecting me to pay it. These greedy, gambling irresponsible banking idiots caused their own losses and it is sad what they have done to the american dream and the lives they have destroyed. Thanks for listening and any helpful advice or info. Best wishes to all with a similar story. I know there are many. I know we’ll all get past this somehow. God bless America.

@Scoop
Wow – I am spinning after reading your post. I’ll address a few concerns that I feel comfortable addressing. Others can help you with their responses, too. We’ve all been there.
Take a deep breath and realize this is not going to be like any previous property sale you have gone through.
The final selling price will be determined by comp’s in your area, in the current short sale/foreclosure market. You need to receive and present offers from highly qualified potential buyers – that’s a major factor for your sale.
Since you’re at the beginning of the short sale process, this is the time to check with a tax professional. Seriously – the numbers you end up with may not at all be what you expect to be working with. Check now to learn your personal tax responsibility, in your state. Go into this as informed and educated as you can be.
You’ve done the right thing by approaching CW to look into homeowner retention – they like to see you have tried to play by their rules.
You’re right about your account status – current vs. “late”. I have been watching my credit report very closely, too. So far I’m still in the same range that I was at the beginning of this process, but the 2 “late payments” show now. As a CW loan holder, you should have a free access subscription to Consumer Info.com b/c of the compromised info that was stolen from a CW employee earlier this year. CW offered this free service to all their customers, and it is a great tool to have right now. I received my letter offering the service in August or September. So far, I’m glad I took the offer.
From what I was told, the “settlement” is a nation-wide retention program. They will be mailing out personalized offers to homeowners, due out before December 1. I don’t know how many households will be involved. I do think it will raise quesitions from people who are currently not in negotiations for refinancing with their lenders, but may be after they receive their offer. CW is already swamped with the current situation. If this rentention plan generates a high volume of calls and inquiries, how much will it change their response time and “customer service?

BJL–
Another big “Thank You’ for posting Mr. Lewis at B of A’s e-mail. I am a buyer, and on Oct. 8, I wrote an e-mail to Mr. Lewis explaining that we have been waiting to see if our offer was approved since April 11, and that we are pre-approved for our FHA loan. Two days later I got a call from the Office of the President of CW on the phone number that I had listed on the e-mail telling me that our file was being moved to a different department with a different negotiator. The next day, the seller’s agent called her and she actually answered the phone. She requested a revised HUD, then contacted him again a few days later to tell him that she was reviewing the offer and needed to see if he could get a HOA lein on the house reduced or removed. He was able to get it reduced to half of the original amount. On Thursday, Oct 23, our file was given to a manager for approvel, On Friday our offer was approved. We recieved it in writing via fax on Saturday morning. We are now doing our inspections and they have given us until Nov 24 to close or their approval is void. Funny how we wait 6 months for them and they give us 30 days, but I’m not complaining. I know that the only reason this has moved along is because Mr. Lewis’ office got my e-mail and got the file into the right hands.
I’ll keep posting as things move along to let everyone know what successes & non successes we have.
Thanks to everyone on this site. We would have given up a long time ago if not for all of your advice!!
TJoy

So, it seems that CW and Chase cannot come to an agreement. Now our agent (he is the agent for us and the seller), wants us to sign a cancellation agreement. Also, he says that it will take some doing for us to get our deposit back.

My question is: Why do we have to cancel the agreement when we are not the ones that didn’t abide by the terms of the agreement. Who cancels the agreement when the lenders won’t agree? And why don’t we automatically get our deposit back from escrow? We held up our end of the bargain….

Thanks for your help

HELP I NEED ADVICDE PERTAINING TO INCOME TAX FROM A SHORT SALE!

We bought a house in the Tampa area (Hillsborough county) FL. in 2005. the Sale price was $235K and we put down about 50K. Our mortgage at the time was about $190K. We refied for $232K in May of 2006 and were duped into a subprime. We now owe $266 and the value of our house is about $189K
We have two short sale offers on our house at the moment…. both for between $185K – $190K
But my biggest concern is about any Income Tax we will be liable for if we allow the sale to go through and Countrywide accepts one of the offers.
We don’t really want to stay in the area but we don’t/won’t have 10′s of thousands of dollars to pay the IRS either….

WHAT CAN WE DO?!?!?
PLEASE HELP!!!!

Thanks Sara, that sounds like good news… Here’s what I was told though…..

that the difference between what I owe and what our original mortgage amount was $190 is what we would owe taxes on….. which is about $70K at the moment.

The house IS our Homestead…. but I’m not sure how much that makes a difference here in FL.

If anyone else can give any more advice I’d sure appreciate it.

I’m fairly certain I’ll have to consult with a Tax Lawyer before we’re said and done.

We put an offer an a house that was a short sale with Countryiwde on August 17. We are now going on 80 days and have heard very little from anyone on where things are in the process. We keep getting told that we will hear “by this date” that day comes and goes, then they say “oh it will be another week.” I know that they are swamped right now but it seems like this is taking a lot longer than most people have experienced. We put in a fill price offer on the list price, including closing, etc. Now I know that the list price is much lower than the how much the loan is on the property. We were told several weeks ago that there was a negotiator assigned but still have heard nothing. Is there going to be a light at the end of this tunnel since a negotiator has supposedly been assigned or are they going to keep stringing us along and eventually counter with a higher price? How long does the negotiation process usually take?

@ All -

I cannot imagine a better illustration of the value of the omnipotent approval letter. These poor folks went the distance but, in fact, never really had a deal because they did not have it in writing.

A competent agent could have saved them much grief and expense. Short sales really aren’t the devil’s work. But they do require diligence, patience and, above all, knowledge.

@ All vets and active service people -

I want to echo Hghlndr’s message and thank all who have served our great nation and defended the cause of freedom. That is one debt that I will never sell short.

@Hghlndr -

Congratulations on getting out of there and into a new place. Hang on, you’re almost there. I look forward to reading about your quick escrow and successful closing!

I was so excited because after 6 months CW approved the short sale (we are the buyers) and we were set to close by the 24th. We have a signed contract with the seller, I had just set up my homeowner's policy, all forms were approved by underwriting–let's just say that all we needed to do was to sign at closing. Well, I get an e-mail from the seller's agent last night stating that the seller has told CW that they want to stay in the home under CW's home retention policy and that they've 'withdrawn' from the short sale. I'm so upset I can hardly speak. I have been patiently waiting for almost 7 months, I have spend over $1000 on inspections and for this to happen right before closing is unfathomable. Luckily, I hadn't given notice on my current rental house.
My question is: since they are under contract with me can they even do this?

Any advice from anyone familiar with this program would be helpful or any Real estate attorney's out there?

Thanks!

@ TJoy:

I'm so sorry to hear about this development on your purchase.
The national home retention program is new and CW is putting a big push on it. It's a blanket offer to everyone whose loan is or may soon be distressed. From what I've heard about the program here, and seen on other consumer sites, there is a chance that just because the offer was made to the sellers, it does not guarantee that they actually qualify for the program. Their decision to "withdraw" may prove to be premature, and it may not be over for you yet. Did you ask your agent if they have anyone in their office that has sufficient experience and/or knowledge, to offer you insight or could help you with this unique situation?

Good luck on it, however it works out – you certainly don't deserve to go through any more stress after being emotionally strung out and playing by the CW rules all this time. Perhaps others on this site will respond with technical information for you about the home retention program and any recourse you might have.

Again – the best of luck.

Thanks highlndr … GOOD LUCK!!! I really hope your verbal approval turns into the real thing!!!

Hi All,
Just wanted to give you quick update. We have been in the process of buying a short sale home since July. The first was CW and the second Chase. Well, Chase wanted $5000 more then what CW was willing to give up. So we ponied up the $5K. We received our approval letters Nov 14th. CW gave us until Dec 12 to close….Chase gave us until Nov 30th. Well, we had to completely redo our loan and in the middle of it my aunt died and we had another family emergency. So we tried to get the loan docs signed before Thanksgiving but they weren't ready until Tuesday before. Unfortunately, we were in a very rural area where FedX only comes in the morning.

We lost our buyer – right when we were trying to schedule contract signing and escrow close date. CW sat on the offer for a month with no action, so we lost one month there, at the beginning. But, this was the buyers changing their mind at the last minute and backing out of the deal. As recent as last Wednesday, the buyers were calling us, b/c they were so very interested in it. The buyers and their agent avoided my agent's calls the last few days until this morning. What is wrong with people?!?

OMG! I want to be done with it. My agent already has it listed again (within the last 2 hours) and she's going to call everyone who has shown interest in it. She is fired up and anxious to sell it, and wants to have another Open House, probably next weekend. The third offer we had is $25k lower than the approved offer, so they’re pretty much out of the question right now. The place is in a great location; very nice neighborhood, it's clean and everything works – how frustrating!!

I am so very tired of these false starts, and all the waiting that every one brings. I am devastated, frustrated, discouraged – and probably in shock.

Hi Reflection,
Yes, She's already been working with the third offer to get him in there with a solid offer. As the seller, my preferred deal would be as close as possible to the one we just lost – due to the settlement payout from me. So, we want to present a solid offer, and hopefully keep the same negotiated settlement.

The backed-out buyer is a teacher who learned after Thanksgiving break staff cuts may start at the beginning of the year. They decided the new mortgage was a chance they just couldn't take. Also, even though we let them know from Day 1 it was a short sale, and the possible headaches included b/c of that – theirs was not the preferred offer until almost 8 weeks into it. That may have been an extra element of surprise to deal with.

So, the condo is being shown again, including an Open House if necessary. We had people who previously showed interest in it, and they are being contacted again. It's featured on communications to other agents as an approved short sale. (Deja vu…) I hope the third time is a charm….

I never could have imagined this sale becoming such a nightmare. Thanks for your support.

I closed too! I put the offer in 5 months ago and almost backed out twice. I had a verbal approval for about 5 weeks before we received the written approval. I only received that after I went on an e-mail and phone campaign. So thank you for Ken Lewis' e-mail address and the information on this website, without, I would have definitely backed out because the process was taking so long – longer than I thought was the worse case scenario.

Hey Dave… I would say just forget this one all together. It is hard enough getting Countrywide to get their act together for a short sale situation where the seller IS actually involved and trying to save their credit. If the seller is shading and unmotivated, Countrywide has less of a reason to do anything. Contrary to what seems to be logical, Countrywide does not care about closing short sales. It takes a lot of work and perserverance, mostly from the sellers side. As a buyer, you really have no power to contact Countrywide about the short sale unless you get express written consent from the seller, which seems unlikely in this situation. Besides, even if by some miracle Countrywide decides to approve the short sale down the line (again, extremely unlikely scenario), then do you really want to get this house when you already know the seller has no qualms about stripping down and destroying in the time he has left in it?

WE CLOSED!!!

6 Months and 6 days after we put in our offer. 80/20 loan with CW being the first and another bank the 2nd. During the 6 months of waiting the sellers had 2 liens put on this property. All of this had to be cleared up before we could close.

Good luck to all of you out there!!!

@drgernwoh –

CW has servicing agreements with a wide variety of investors. Their arrangement with each of these investors varies as well. In many cases, CW has 'delegated decision' making powers. That is to say that the investor has empowered CW to act on their behalf in matters such as negotiating short sale payoff amounts and terms, even though the loan does not belong to CW. The relatively quick turnaround — in the world of CW — suggests such an arrangement with Bank of New York.

Your intuition is correct. The title officer is asking for a doc that will likely never happen — not in time to do you any good at least. CW uses a standard form letter for short sale acceptance that has been approved by their legal dept. To my knowledge, they never deviate from that form. Find out specifically what title is looking for. Don't wait for your agent to do it, pick up the phone today and get the story for yourself. Be assertive, you are the one writing the checks here. If they are less than compliant, consider switching title companies.

A follow-up to the list: we closed today (Jan 14th) almost 4 months from our original offer without difficulty (except for a dose of winter in NW OH).

We believe the primary difficulty came from lack of understanding (trust?) of any relationship between CW and Bank of New York by the title insurance underwriter. Our old-school, semi-retired attorney, based on his reading of the Commitment for Title Insurance had been adamant from the start that the seller should have been negotiating directly with BoNY rather than CW — CW had nothing to do with this deal in his opinion (which, of course, was wrong, but we kept him on anyway). So when the CW acceptance letter came, our attorney likely made certain that he underwriter at the title company followed through on this. Another realtor specializing in short sales suggested to me immediately following the Dec 30th postponement that the firm/attorney handling the foreclosure for BoNY/CW was the key — it took the title company 10 days to figure this out, and then got it wrong. Based on information from the seller and her realtor, we got the title company talking directly to the foreclosing attorney's office, and within the hour, our closing was scheduled for the next morning.
VA Loan Guy is correct about the CW standard acceptance letter and their servicing agreements with investors (and we had no reason to not trust it). In our case, however, a conservative title company didn't trust this CW/BoNY relationship until that relationship was explained sufficiently by the foreclosure attorney (or so we believe).
One more point: based on earlier posts here, I sent an e-note off to [email protected] explaning our difficulty in getting the title company to accept the acceptance letter on its face. After some more research, I came across a few more e-mail address at Countrywide, and sent similar messages late last week, then again on Monday. 20 minutes after our closing was scheduled, I received a phone call from someone claiming to be in the Office of the President at CW, telling me that they had also been in contact with the title company closing agent, and gave me her direct number in case there was any further difficulty with the closing. I don't know what communication prompted that action, but I did find it interesting.

All more than a little frustrating, but, in the end, we made it work out.

@ John –

130k is a pittance compared to some of the losses I've seen recently on short sales. Really, what is an 'acceptable loss' is relative to many factors including the original loan amount and current local market conditions. The fact is, foreclosures cost lending institutions like CW a lot of time and money to process and liquidate. You should open the dialogue with them today and find a competent, short sale savvy real estate agent to help you negotiate an agreement with your lenders.

Great information folks! I started searching the net last night about Countrywide short sales and found this wonderful blog. I will be submitting an offer early next for a property that is a Countrywide short sale and I should be the first to submit. The agent representing me is also the selling agent…she is great. She also recognizes that she is not an expert in these and has a specialized short sale broker that is working for her behind the scenes.

On some other blogs, I have read conversation that it is Countrywide's policy to have my lending (the buyer's lending) through Countrywide in order for the deal to work. Can anyone confirm or refute this information? The house on the propery is an incomplete remodel and the lending has to be a construction type of loan. I have secured the funding however it is not through Countrywide as most people are not writing these types of loans today.

Thank you in advance – Gary

Gary, I'm not so sure about that. My pre-approval was thru CountryWide and 5 months later I'm still waiting. Last week I was so annoyed at how the long the process was taking I took $10,000 off my original offer. Something tells me I've just added 5 more months to this already drawn out process.

@ Gary –

There is no truth to that rumor and CW is in no position to make such demands. I would also advise you to be extremely vigilant when dealing with an agent that is not short sale savvy. Be sure that you have all of the addendums applicable in your State. They will save you much grief and thousands of dollars. If in doubt, post here and I will help you.

@ Tired –

Regrettably, I have to say that you probably did add more delay to the process. Any time something changes, the paperwork has to be scrutinized further. Unless CW has rejected your offer or the property simply does not appraise well, it does not serve you to alter the deal. Having noted that, your frustration is understood and shared by many on this board.

The short-sale process seems pretty unnerving for both buyers and sellers alike. Based on a lot of the feedback that I've read, it seems like Countrywide has little interest in the short-sell.
I spoke to the VA about my loan and they mentioned that they don't really get involved anymore unless it reaches the foreclosure process (and it sounds like they're an arbitrator more than anything else).

I wish I had known about Countrywide when my loan was sold to them… I would've refinanced with a different company.

@ Gary –

Addendums are clauses which either add to or alter the terms of the purchase contract. They are used for special situations, some of which are fairly common, such as short sales, estate sales, unfinished homes and the like. Most States have some type of 'Short sale addendum', the purpose of which is to protect the buyer and seller from some of the common pitfalls of this type of transaction. Amongst other notables, it typically contains a clause –
1. advising that the contract is contingent upon acceptance by the seller's lender — translated; no approval letter, no deal.
2. stating that the seller intends to excersize due diligence by providing the lender with all required documentation in a timely manner. I refer to such terms as a 'kick in the butt clause' — a reminder that all parties share some liability for non-compliance.

VA Loan Guy, cg, and Mieks –
I actually signed my doc's last Saturday – and no payout!!! What a wild ride!! We presented and were appproved three times for my short sale with CW – and lost buyers 2x.
Since April when I first requested consideration for a short sale, CW drug their feet on approval, lost dozens of doc's, phone rep's repeatedly lied to us about the progress/status. So, in October I got the attention of the office of the Prez, and they worked with us on my sale(s).
I moved out in Nov., but kept the place clean, the HOA account current, and utilities on so it could show in its best light. Ironically, from Dec. 1 to Jan 10 (when one buyer walked, and the next one came along…) the accepted sale price dropped $20k; but CW approved it – again.
I've actually signed my doc's – I have no payout – I can't believe it!!
I get exhausted just thinking about it. My average credit score has dropped about 80 points in the last 5 months – so now I need to request a "rapid rescore" to get that addressed.
*** sigh *** What a nightmare! But it's almost over!!!

My account was watched over by Office of the Prez since early October, and below are my time frames.
I'd like to add a note about how the "investors" look at buyers' financing: My condo ended up going to a $350k all cash sale. I asked the negotiator – will this be a slam dunk now that we have an all cash offer? Her response was "no – absolutely not. Cash only makes no difference to them – they are ultimately looking at their loss on the deal. But, they do want a strong offer, of course." I, as the seller, had to submit updated and thorough personal financial reports with every offer considered.
The offer that was considered before this one was a LosAngelesUSD financing, offering $370k with a larger down. That offer was selected over another buyer's offer of $375k with a smaller down. They preferred the lower loan to value ratio, so it was the way that offer was written. And, that buyer walked Dec. 1st – theirs was a 2-month wait to approval.
And, it did finally sell for $350k cash – submission of offer to escrow signing took 4 weeks. I wouldn't wish this experience on anyone.

Thank you for the kind words, VA Loan Guy!!
I just checked my True Credit 3-score report subscription. (An investment I promised myself in the midst of this)
It's not as bad as I thought – my range among the 3 scores is from the 740's to the 670's. I am going to submit a packet to all 3 bureaus, including printouts of when my mortgage was in "Collections Suspended" status, so I can get a boost back into those scores. My agent suggested the Rapid Rescore request, and I documented it all – so I'll try it.
Whew – I definitely learned a lot through this process.
Thanks again to all for your support. This site was definitely a blessing, with all the info posted here.

My house is at a market value of 176k. We bought it 5 yrs ago. The loan was 153k and now it is down to 146k. We are paying PMI too on the mortgage. We have countrywide as the lender. We are thinking of doing a short sale on the house because we lost one of our job. We are thinking of doing a short sale at 100k. Do you think countrywide will approve it? Should we go through the hassle or simply just foreclose it?

gabriel, I have been negotiating short sales over a year now. Typically if you are not the high bid on the property the lienholder does not want the offer submitted. I tell my buyers right away to make their highest and best offer because it won't be submitted if it isn't the best on the table. He shouldn't have told you he submitted it though, and left you hanging like that. Although, he really doesn't have to tell you anything at all if he doesn't want to.

Steph –
As a seller, you will be asked to disclose to CW your actual, current finances (probably 2x) every time you have a potential buyer. CW asked me for my current finances at the beginning of each offer submittal, and at the end when the third-party investor reviewed the offers for final approval (to determine what the seller's pay out amount may be.)
When I complained that I had already given them my current finances for the existing offer, they responded that they want as current as possible, and the ones they had were more than 45 days old. (They had the file so long, the process had passed their own guideline of what is preferred as "current.")
I hope this info helps clear it up a bit.

Current Short Sale timeline from CW site: (Sorry – you may want to Copy & paste to a new doc to read this better)
Part 1
Call (800) 669-6650 Please have your Loan Number and Property Address ready when you call

Additional Useful Information To Have Ready When You Call:
*** A brief explanation of your circumstances: Include Recent income documents (such as Pay stubs; Benefit statements from Social Security, Disability, Unemployment, Retirement, or Public Assistance. If you are Self-employed, have your tax returns or a Year-to-Date Profit and Loss statement available for reference); Bank Statements and Tax Returns for Past 2 Years

*** Property Disposition Options: If you are not interested or are unable to retain homeownership, the following programs may be available: Short Sale / You may be able to sell your property at its fair market value even if the sale's proceeds are less than what is owed on your loan.

Thank God this is finally over!!! I have been reading this site for the past few months as my husband and I awaited anxiously for our shortsale to go through. I have held back posting comments b/c I was so angry with CW that I couldn't bring myself to even describe my situation. I would like to encourage all of you sellers (and buyers), CW is slow, but patience is definitely virtue. I was fortunate enough to have very patient buyers, who made it very clear that were willing to wait as long as it took. Here's the rundown of my situation:
-09/29/2008 received offer for $200k (list price was $205k, outstanding loan approx $260)
-11/24/2008 CW assigned a a representative (this was not the negotiator)
-01/2009 Negotiator assigned
-01/26/2009 Shortsale and offer was approved
-02/2009 CW appraisal and buyer's appraisal completed
02/27/2009 WE CLOSED!!!!!
It took 5 months to close. Keep in mind, the timeline does not reflect a lot of back and forth, back and forth, between myself and CW. They lost/did not receive some of my documents more than twice.

Also, if you are checking the workout notes on under your account that tells you the progress of your SS, CW will give you a date that something will be complete and instruct you not to call them before that date because it will cause delays. THAT'S A LIE! First, the date they give you means absolutely nothing because they never complete anything by the dates they tell you. Call them whenever you feel you need an update or if too much time has gone by without your hearing anything. I'm sure CW is busy with tons of SS's, but you have to be persistent to get things moved along. I was amazed that it only took 5 months for me after I read many of the posts on this site. But please stay encouraged, I know it's VERY frustrating. My closing even took 3 and 1/2 hours b/c the CW funder kept disappearing (maybe went to lunch or something) and claimed she didn't receive the title company's paperwork more than once, so that was even frustrating, but nonetheless, it's over!!!

Highldnr – Yes, their processes and communication are completely broken. I hope your closing is still set to go for tomorrow and I hope you don't have to go thru the drama I did at my closing. It was taking so long that both attorneys had to leave to go to other appointments and the title company had another group to close sitting in the waiting area. Hope everything works out! BTW, do you know if there CW is suppose to send out additional paperwork outside of the closing paperwork?

Hi Chris,
I have checked my scores all along. About a year ago, CW sent out a letter offering their customers a free 2-yr membership to ConsumerInfo (Experian) because of a security breach by an employee. I have that and a subscription to TransUnion. I got divorced almost 5 years ago, so I've been very aware of being a newly single mother and focused on maintaining high scores as an individual. I have one score under 700 right now, and there is misinformation on that report about the mortgage, so I need to address it directly with that company. I printed out every time my sales were approved and fell apart, b/c the loan is "no payment due at this time" or "payment due" based on the status of it being in the "considering offer" stage. I plan to send the bureaus a summary of the short sale saga with a request for a Rapid Re-score.

Hello all,

My wife and I are hoping for a faster result than the experiences I’m reading about here. We are in the early stages with CW. We had our offer on a short sale home accepted by the seller on Feb. 11 09, so we are 3 weeks into the process.

Our agent told us that the negotiating with the lender has to be handled by the sellers agent and the title company. He said the title company being used is very proactive and will be contacting the lender a couple times a week.

We have a deadline on the offer contract for mid-March for the lender to respond to our offer. From what I’m reading from others experieces we shouldn’t be too optimistic about hearing back by the deadline?

We’re suppose to get an update about where we are in the process from CW on this upcoming Monday. I’ll post back with updates on our process as we go. If any of you have any advice on how to get the offer into the negotiator’s hands more quickly, please let me know?

Hi Chris,
I contacted my agent today. She said I should expect my closing paperwork from the escrow company in the mail next week at the latest. At that point, there is nothing else for me to sign, receive, or file. I will officially be DONE with this nightmare!!

Hi Chris. This process should have taken no more than 30 days to get approved. Like everything their are certain shortcuts your realtor could have taken…The problem in taking too long is that all documents have to be refreshed..ie. last 2 months bank statements, paystubs. Value was also different when you started and the house may not appraise for the buyer…Dealing witha knowledgeable realtor makes a world of difference.

I was told this week by my agent that the lady at the title company who is handling the process with Countrywide on this deal, who does SS all day every day, says that her experience with Countrywide right now is 2-3 months from the time they accept the package, which they have in my case. So I guess I need to just sit and be patient.

@ Small World –

We should begin by noting that a short sale will only remedy your mortgage woes. Consumer tradelines such as credit cards, installment loans and the like are an entirely different matter. Lenders like CW are only interested in whether you can pay your mortgage. If the answer is no, then you have sufficient cause to pursue a short sale. You need not demonstrate abject poverty, only the inability to keep up with mortgage payments. If you wish to protect your good credit, missing payments on credit cards and auto leases would be the wrong way to go.
Simply beginning the short sale dialogue with CW will not wound your credit. It is only affected adversely when:
- you start missing payments
- a short sale is closed (the damage can be nominal depending on the # of missed payments)
- your property is foreclosed on by the lender either by trust deed or deed in lieu

Dear Small World,

Your credit becomes affected as soon as you become late on your mortgage. Based on the fico score your credit started from, i.e. someone with 780 fico will probably get hit about 200 points whereas someone with a 600 fico will probably get hit about 100 pouints. The issue right now is getting out of this property and having you be in control of how it will be done as opposed to the lender foreclosing on you. you will then be able to rebuild your credit and based on current fha guidelines, be able to purchase again in 24 months. My company and I have over 200 active shortsales in California with a team of seasonned negotiators working on your behalf. No up front cost to you. If your lender is countrywide, i can get this done in 60 days or less as we arte in a preffered program with them. None of the horror stories your hear about on all the bloggs. The key for you is asking a lot of kestions and you'll be able to know exactly what route to take…..

My company's website is http://www.360realty.com

In response to your post. Yes I can recommend an agent there for you. You should start on it now but you have plenty of time as you have not become late. It takes a minimum of 6 month for the property to get foreclosed on.

1. Who are your lenders and how much do you owe on each?

2. Your credit will get hit as soon as you miss your first mortgage payment.

3. 360 realty can do all the paperwork and negotiation on your behalf. The agent on the ground in VA will take care of marketing the property and finding a buyer.
With Countrywide 360 realty deals directly with the office of the president with a dedicated team of Countrywide representatives. We can get this done in abou 60 days… Countrywide will also pay your property taxes and up to $8,000 to satisfy the second lien holder. 360 realty would represent you in negotiating this.

4. It all rest in the offer being about 10-15% of the market value, not what you owe…. I will help you determine what is acceptable to the lender.

If you need to email me confidential info use [email protected]

4.

4.CW will want your agent to submit a 'BPO' — a broker's price opinion. Based on that figure, CW will weigh offers from potential buyers. It is in everyone's best interest that the BPO be a reasonable figure for a quick sale. Lenders gain nothing by insisting on a higher price — such is a good way for a lender to become a homeowner. Again, a competent — and persuasive — agent is the key.

Disregard anyone who suggests that you leave it all to them and just wait for the phone call with the good news. Your knowledge, vigilance and direct participation are required to assure success.

Hi all –
What an impossible journey this sounds like. We are trying to do a short sale on our house which we are severely under water on. (It's listed now, no offers yet.) If we succeed, do any of you know how long we'd have to wait before buying a new house somewhere (assuming we could get financing)?

TIA,
CiCi

I, myself closed on a CW short last September. They did take a BPO and later ordered an independent appraisal which actually came in about $15k higher than the BPO. They accepted the BPO any way and I closed about 3 weeks later. The listing agent — whom I know pretty well — is a genuine short sale expert and really went to bat for his client.

We are trying to purchase a short sale home. It has been a month now with no response from the sellers lender CW. We hate all of this waiting around, as the buyer is there anything we can do to speed up this horrible process? Also the seller accepted our offer, but we now have to wait to hear from CW? Why would the seller have any right to accept offers if its not there decision anyway?

Thanks Stephan. The listing agent is experienced but we our still confused about this entire process. We really love the home so hopefully it will pay off to be patient. 299,000 asking price. 285,000 offer (accepted). Appraisal from our lender 325,000. Can the appraisal give CW the right to go after the full 325,00 or just the 299,000? Thanks for any help.

My Fiance and I put an offer in on a short sale from Countrywide back in October of 08. It is now the end of March 09 (5 months later) and we still have not hear a thing. About a month and a half ago we got a call from the listing agent asking us if we were still interested b/c the lender is ready to move on it. We said yes we are still interesed and even drew up an addendum re-instating the October offer. We gave them 30 days to reply. 45 days later we still have not heard a thing. Our agent has called the listing agent for a status but the listing agent says she has NO IDEA when we will hear anything. Apparently the file went to a negotiator but then was re-assigned to another negotiator b/c the orginal one has way too much work. We are ready to pull the offer. This is holding up my fiance and I to become a family. VERY FRUSTRATING.

@ BWAT –

Your agent mistaken. Escrow officers have little vested interest in making the sale go and they aren't in the pestering business. Realtors are. Any seasoned escrow officer knows that a short sale contract without a written approval letter from the lender is NOT an active contract. Frankly, aside from a prelim title search, there is little to be done as far as title work is concerned until the approval letter is issued. The listing agent will need to take the point in pursuing CW as will the seller.

Don't be so sure. I am been waiting since November 08 and the appraisal was done two months ago. This is the second house that I try to buy wich is own by CW. I gave up with the first house after waiting 9 months. Nothing seems to work.

@ BWAT –

Make sure you have your current VA Certificate of Eligibility in hand and ready to go. Many lenders can now handle this for you quickly and easily via the ACE system. Also, the home will need to be in decent shape and move-in ready. The VA is not fond of "fixers" and the appraiser will note any such serious deficiencies. Be sure to keep your loan officer up to date on the events as they unfold. CW typically does not allow for lengthy escrow periods, so your lender will need to assign an appraiser and move quickly for a timely closing

Just fyi info re: After the short sale… It's been 4 weeks since my short sale closed – and I monitor my credit weekly. 2 bureaus are now showing notes re: CW other than the payment being late – notes are "Improved" on Transunion and "Settlement" on Experian. My scores are still 2 – mid 700's and a 694. A little lower than before, but not horrible.
Please note – even after it closed; CW called me to ask when I would get the account current. (Arrgghh!!) I repeatedly told them my condo had sold. I tried to be proactive in working with them, but was told it could take up to 30 days for all their departments to be advised of the final SALE. I finally contacted the negotiator who handled my sale; and she updated all their info systems. No more calls for over a week now!! Yay!!.
By not paying my mortgage while waiting on the short sale, I didn't have the interest to write off on taxes, so I owe over $3000 combined for state and federal. That's it – I hope this info answers some q's about AFTER the short sale nightmare.
Best wishes and good luck to all of you ~

to highlndr:
"By not paying my mortgage while waiting on the short sale, I didn't have the interest to write off on taxes, so I owe over $3000 combined for state and federal. "
how many months have u not made your payments prior to short sale closing? how does one figure out the state and federal taxes payable?
thanks.

@ VA Loan Guy and others I have communicated with along the way,

I would just like to say thank you one more time for the information, encouragement and support you provided to me, and continue to provide – to everyone on this site. I can't imagine going through this ordeal without the support and information sharing here. It was one year ago this week that I found out my condo would have to be listed as a short sale. It was "sold" two times before the final sale finally went through, and it finally closed, just one month ago.

I'd like to add, To any sellers who are totally stressed and feel like your sale will never happen – Hang in there!! It's only been a month since my sale closed, and it is such a huge relief!! It already feels like it was a lifetime ago.
**Thanks and Good Luck**

@ highlndr

I contacted an Assistant VP in the mortgage loan department at the HQ for B of A named Anthony Ebright. He wasn’t much help and wrote back the following:

“I would love to help you, but there’s nothing I can do. You will have to deal with the long wait until the banks get caught up. ”

Just wondering if you had the name of the individual who helped you out @ B of A ?

Thanks in advance!

@ highlndr

I tried contacting the e-mail you sent me, but it got bounced back saying that address no longer existed. Thanks again for trying to help, this process is so frustrating.

I have just purchase dean Graziosi profit from real estaste book with no money down. How do you go through these short sales with the bank if you have no money down or any purchasing steps I need the 1-2-3- and a-b-c- because the book goes all around this step.

Wow! And I thought I had it bad! Reading all these comments is making me more sick.

The taxpayers are being looted trillions of dollars and I can’t even get a measly short-sale home because Countrywide … I don’t know! I don’t know what they are doing. I can’t get any answers and I’m fed up!

We put an offer on a short-sale in January 2009 and it’s been on a mystery negotiator’s desk at Countrywide for almost 30 days. My agent is supposedly an experienced short-sale person and they can’t get any answers.

What is the problem? I don’t believe the lines that I’ve been given about Countrywide being overwhelmed. There are a thousand excuses out there. Is this amusing to them? Or are we dealing with B of A?

Thanks for reading my rant.

As a seller, I have been very concerned about the hit I would take on my credit scores. I just checked my credit report tracking sites. My short sale closed 9 weeks ago, and this is the first month since October 08 that I have no negative entries or comments on my credit report, so this is great news!! If my credit scores have already hit the bottom after the short sale, I don’t have much to complain about. The worst hit to my credit report was about 40 points, and I’ve just sent letters to the 3 bureaus re: the short sale. So, maybe now I can breathe again…

@ Highlndr,

Thank you for the reply. I will be writing emails to Countrywide/BA executives and calling 866-880-1232.

I tried emailing [email protected] but I received a failure notice.

I’ll keep everyone updated.

Call it a coincidence…I don’t know. 20-30 minutes after I emailed the CEO of Bank of America the head of the real estate company I’m using for the short sale called me.

He said that he talked to the negotiator at Countrywide and they are now countering. They are countering $15,000 more than our offer! After all these months they are countering that much over?

Our offer was definitely NOT a low-ball offer.

I would definitely say that I don’t believe that is an accurate BPO that they conducted.

@ Jeff

What was the email address of the CEO of Bank of America that you used?

We are close to being in the same situation as you, a negotiator has been assigned and they did the BPO on the house a week ago. We’re expecting word back on our offer any day now.

Thanks,

Barry

Wow, this website has been eye opening, and overwhelming to say the least. Even after spending hours reading post after post of how much CW sucks, I can honestly saw I am a bit relieved its not just me going through hell. So maybe since we’re all in the same boat some of you can shed some light on my situation.

My husband and I stumbled upon a house in Georgia, It was supposedly foreclosed, but when we made the offer at the beginning of march, we found out CW never actually followed through foreclosure with the previous owner, so after coverting to short sale, the previous owner accepted our offer, but we all know with CW that doesn’t mean JACK.

In April we were assigned a Negotiator, the property was appraised, and now halfway through May I just found out they have ordered a BPO. I really don’t have any experience in real estate, and this will be our first home, so I’m really not sure where to gauge our progress, and if we’re anywhere near an accept/counter situation. Does anyone have experience with BPO’s?

We are dealing with an agent who says she calls CW once a week for updates, I call her about twice a week to make sure she’s actually doing her job AND send her emails. I hate feeling left in the dark, which seems to be Countrywide’s MO. We are holding on the the fact that we are the ONLY offer on the house.

Any advice is greatly appreciated!

@Eric,
That fax number was from when I dealt directly with CW Ofc of the Pres staff in the Calabasas office – five months into the process, and in the process of losing my second “buyer”. It was a blessing, because the communications I sent there always got into the right hands. I can’t say it was always the news I wished for; but it was current info, and I actually rec’d follow-up calls. So, they “coordinated” things for me. The staff there are not “financial” or “mortgage” people, but they run the administrative offices for the executives. So, you might not get miracles, but it’s a step…

My husband and i are currently feeling the crunch as our lease is about to run out and are hunting for a quick place to move until CW makes up their mind. Its been 10 days since our last update from CW, no word on the BPO. I’ve been putting the pressure on the real estate agent but doesn’t seem to be getting anywhere.. Frustrated, needed to vent, not sure what else to do

Marcus,

I’m attaching an email from Countrywide with the steps and approximate time frame that was emailed to me. We have an offer in a home in San Diego and were lucky enough to have a friend high up in the company so it was escalated right away. I’m not sure what that means but our offer went in mid April and the appraisal has been done and submitted and it is now in phase 2 assigned to the next negotiator.

1. Fax packages to 888-491-4947, no cover sheet required, account number on every page.
2. CW receives 10-30k faxes per day
3. Any packages between 50-100 pages are overloading their server and are automatically get dropped, we will still receive confirmation on our side however it will not be received on their side
4. CW requests that we send 10 pages at a time and fax after 5pm local time
5. Packages should include the following: offer, hud, listing agreement, hardship letter, 2 years taxes, 2 months bank statements, and auth letter
6. 7 business days to receive a fax
7. If there is no foreclosure status a BPO will be ordered TAT=13 days, if there is a foreclosure status, file is assigned to Phase 1 and negotiator will manage BPO
8. Receipt of BPO valuation will take 10 days to log in their system
9. Phase 1 negotiator assigned in 10-17 days. Phase 1 reviews docs received and ensures that the BPO is in. Phase 1 TAT= file for 15 business days
10. Phase 2 negotiator ensures that the transaction is an arm’s length transaction and double checks the docs. Phase 2 TAT= 15-30 calendar days
11. File then is with Manager for approval for 5 business days. If it has mortgage insurance, the file is with M.I. company for 14-21 days
12. File then goes to the investor. TAT=30-45 days
13. If approved, TAT=7 days for a final approval letter

**Please keep in mind that if there are any changes to the transaction even with the same buyer, the file is returned to Phase 1.

Thanks for the replies, both of you. This is so frustrating… my wife is flipping out and wants to move NOW… I hesitate to go through the pain and hassle of a move only to have the property suddenly come available in 4-5 weeks…. Ugh. After sticking it out for over six months it would be a total waste of time, money, and energy to bail on it now. But again, my wife has had it.

My general feeling is that a threat to walk would simply kill the deal altogether.

Unreal.

Update:

Got word today that CW has all the docs they need from the seller, the BPO was done a few weeks back, and that everything has been turned over to the “Final Negotiator”.

Which we were told means that we should finally have an answer in a couple weeks. We better because our rate lock expires June 29, so we need to close by then to not lose our 4.5% rate.

See my posts above to see our entire timeline.

Thanks for listening. aaaAAARRRHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!

We put an offer on a short sale property 7 months ago and still have not received a written approval from Countrywide! The short sale process is so frustrating! I would never recommend buying a short sale!

BWAT- I hate to burst your bubble and I hope you have better luck than we have had, but, our BPO was done at least 3 months ago and our offer has been with the “Final Negotiator” for about 2 months. This is a never ending mess and I feel like we are getting the run around.

@ BECCA
a threat to withdraw the offer will not get things moving from Bank of Americas stand point but if the listing agent takes that to Bank of America they will close down the file which will really slow things down.

The question is . . IS the listing agent following up at least weekly?

Also please I am a novice in realestate purchase is anybody kind enough to list the process of buying ass from cw for me? Below is where I am right now.

Found house May 1
Made offer May 1
seller signed May 6
Approval certificate form B of A may 22
titlework completed may 29th.

I am told to wait for phone to ring or go look for something else. Pls do u know the steps till I can move to theis dream house?

Hi All,

My wife and I put in an offer on a SS last week. The listing agent said there were already two offers in and the negotiator was being assigned today… My questions is: will CW negotiator look at all offers in hand at once or do they go down the line until they find one they like?

Also, what does anyone know about sellers assit on a short sale? Will CW do a seller assist? The list price is 188900. We offered 191000 with 6% sellers assit.

Thanks in advace,

From what I understand CW will only take one offer at a time. They do not want multiple offers being submitted. If a negotiator is being assigned it would be to one offer. Not all banks work this way but I’m almost positive CW does. The selling agent will try to get many offers and the higher the better for his commission. It’s the sellers agent who submits the offer. If you read my post above of what the steps are for CW you will see an offer is not assigned to a negotiator until 2+weeks after the offer has been submitted.

Also I have learned that with any short sale they will not always take the highest offer but they look for the strongest. Sometimes if the house appraises lower than your offer they might not accept it or require you to change it. Strange but this is what is going on out there.

I’m not sure if the location of the property matters or what area of the country it is in. Do all offers go to the same office? I know there is one in Simi Valley, CA and one in Texas. That might be worth researching.

After months of looking and researching homes I am using a method that works best for us. Going directly to the listing agent to put our offer in. I found the house we wanted and called the listing agent to put the offer in for us. This way he has more reason to put our offer in right away and not wait for others offers to come in as he will get the sellers and buyers commission from us. I also let him know we will be using other agents if this does not go through. I have never met him and he has only submitted our offer. We had a contact at CW and had the short sale moved along so I do not feel obligated to stay with this realtor. The market is crazy right now with more buyers than homes for sale in our area.

Congrats BWAT

I would counter at $665 and see what they say.

We also heard last Thursday that our offer was with the 2nd Negotiator or in phase 2. I just got a call that they came back with a counter offer and we have 72 hours to respond.

I’m really irritated with the listing agent. They listed the house at $629. Our offer was $630 and we cannot go higher, this house has Mello Roos and HOA which adds up to almost $500 a month in extra payments and it has to be paid monthly.

List price $629
Our offer $630 (was put in mid April)
CW counter offer $700

We also just found out the lowest a home has sold for in the past three months in this neighborhood is $725 and the house we want has a big lot with a view. It’s so frustrating that the house was listed this low and we went through all of this only to find out it was listed $70k less than it should have been.

Good luck everyone.

My wife and I are in the process of trying to buy our first home in the SF Bay Area and lucky us it is a Countrywide SS. Our offer went in over a month ago and they had the BPO done last Thursday. Does that mean that a Negotiator has been assigned and hopefully the situation is progressing? Our offer is exactly what we were told CW wanted and matches fair market value according to the comps.

Our Agent has been trying to call daily but they never return her messages. They do sometimes return the sellers messages but it is always the same “tell the buyers to be patient, it takes time.” Citibank is the 2nd and they will foreclose if CW doesn’t accept by the end of the month or we pay them (which we had to do last week). Based on others experience, what is the likelihood of having an accepted offer before the end of the month? Any suggestions for trying to speed up the process? I hope this doesn’t take six months like some people here have experienced here and thanks for everyone’s comments/suggestions. It feels a little more like we’re not in this alone. Good luck to everyone else.

Nevermind, I just found Turn Around Time elsewhere on the web.

Update:

We received word at the end of may that our file had been sent to the “Investor” and we would have our next update today. I can only hope we are nearing the end of this rollercoaster from hell. We are not about to threaten a walk as we have already invested months of waiting and are scared to death of stalling our offer. We are still the only offer on this home, and hope this will be leaverage for negotiation.

I also was curious about market differences and how CW does business… I am in Georgia and my experience appears to be very similar to you guys in SF area.

@ BWAT

I am so glad it worked out for you! It is quite refreshing to see it work out when we are going through the same process!

Update:
Received word today our file has been with the investor for one week and he has until the 25th of june to send a counter-offer or approve our offer as it is. I can only hope we are nearing an end and it works out! If so, it will be worth the wait.

Becca,

I know you asked BWAT but I will tell you what we have experienced.

Once we heard our offer was with the second negotiator (same day as BWAT) we had a counter offer within less than a week. We countered that last Thursday and we are still waiting to hear.

Our offer $630
CW counter $700
Our counter $675

@ BWAT

Congrats!!! Hopefully our SS has a happy ending also. Going on 3 and a half months now, looking forward to a end here real soon.

Thanks BWAT & LoganT~ Sounds like I can be expecting a call any minute now with the counter offer. I am deeply encouraged by all of the happy endings!

Hi CaliShan:

WOW… since November 2008 … ! And you wonder why the real estate is losing value. Banks are just sitting on the offers. Well CaliShan … I am in the same boat in the sense my wife and I love the house. As stated before it has gone through all three stages of Countrywide process and is sitting with the investors for 3 months. I have even threaten to walk away but investors don’t care. Walk and they’ll find some other sucker. But the problem is that I already spend money in the appraisal, pet inspection and the escrow is already opened. And that means absolutely nothing to them.

But I don’t blame Countrywide because they are only the intermediary between the investor and collecting mortgage payments. They do not have the ultimate say on the loan. The final investors are i.e., Wells Fargo, U.S. Bank, Bank of America, Chase … etc. The problems lies with the investors not Countrywide.

I wish there was some legislation which imposed all investors on a short-sale to respond within 2 months of receiving the short-sale. The problem with unrestricted time to respond on the short-sale has negative consequence such as: (a) the property remains empty potential for being broken in, items stolen, drug spot to shoot up, .. etc and (b) the surrounding homes also lose value because the grass is growing, unwanted bugs have moved in and made it there home .. etc.

But the realistic of it is that we have to wait. Anyways recently I have heard that in June of 2009 Countrywide started an online case management system whereby agents can follow the process of the short-sale online. Do you know if this is true and what is the link for it? Thanks.

@ confuzed

In most cases the listing agent doesn’t even know what the BPO comes in at. We had our own appraisal done we are the buyers (hopefully). That’s the only way we were going to find out the actual value. You can’t get upset with your realtor, she really plays a very small role in this whole thing. The listing realtor needs to be on his/her game though. Our realtor is family so I don’t feel bad calling her 2x a week to bug the listing realtor for updates.

I am very disgusted with this waiting game….rates are climbing and it’s going to cost us more in the end. If there ever is a end, we were supposed to hear something last week then this week……ARGHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wife and I are so jaded right now.

Thanks for the info. It is definitely a long and frustrating process. Do you think it is a smart idea for us to just go ahead and have our own appraisal done? The housing market in our area (southwest Ohio) has taken a hit, although nothing like the rest of the country.

Thanks Bob, I agree there is a lot of work to be done! I don’t know that my realtor is not doing the work required, its just that after we decided to put an offer in on this house, she has not been the most pleasant person (she did not want us to put an offer in the house). She is very curt and doesn’t offer any more info than I ask for, and I just don’t know if I am asking the right questions.

I have seen advice about calling CountryWide and sending letters to upper mangement there. Is this stuff that I can do?

Thanks Jag. We put in our offer in the middle of April. Countrywide countered three days later, we responded that day. A week later we heard that Countrywide ordered a BPO. The BPO was completed about two weeks ago, but we have not heard anything yet. So we sit and wait. Well, not completely, we jump every time the phone rings hoping it is them.
How is your short sale going?

@ confused

Wow confused you actually had a response so quick from Countrywide after putting an offer in April. I placed my offer on March 14, 2009 and the junior lien holder – Bank of America – signed off on the loan in May 2009 but the senior lender – also Bank of America – is yet to sign off on the loan. We have been assigned a negotiator/BPO has already been ordered/it has gone through all 7 million stages of Countrywide and they have signed off on it and forward to the investor to sign off. Unfortunately the investor – Bank of America – is sitting in Hawaii drinking mai mai and could careless how the housing industry is doing. The senior investor received the short-sale on May 10, 2009 and is just sitting on it.

How about you Confused?

No Way Out – does HUD/Hope offer any help with mediating between you and your lender?

@ confuzed

They did assist us with a hardship package for CW which CW 1st said they didn’t have and then said they did have but said the information was incorrect even though I was looking at the exact copy HUD sent them. I had the agent with CW I spoke with update my file with the correct information and then was told that short sale was it, no other options.

What do I look for in a short sale agent? How do I know who is experienced, etc…

Just a quick update…. our short sale offer is going nowhere, we stumbled upon another comperable home in a great location/upscale neighborhood and have put in an offer. THank god the second home is no where near countrywide, and we hope to move much faster as this home is not a short sale. Good luck to the rest of you who are sticking it out, unfortunately, we don’t have anymore time to waste.

Hey Jag, well I sent your suggested questions to my realtor. Now I guess I’ll just wait to see if she responds before CountryWide
Thanks for your help, I’ll let you know what she says.

JM- Can you go to the sheriff’s sale? You might get a better deal than CountryWide would ever be able to work out with you, and you will definetly get a better deal on closing costs. My brother tried for months to work out his shortsale, it did not go through. So he went to the sheriff’s sale and purchases the house for 30,ooo less than what the Bank had agreed to before the deal fell through.

More FRUSTRATION!

We got the ball rolling by having a contact at CW May 8th with a $630. We were countered a few weeks ago at $700. We countered that offer 2 weeks ago with $675.

We just today found out that CW or the negotiator accepted our offer last Friday!?! WTF?? Our agent who is the listing and selling agent did not tell us. We found out from our contact.

We called to figure out just why we are not being informed about this and the answer was they can not get ahold of the owners of the house. They need to sign off on this and they are not answering their phone? This sounds so fishy and we requested all the information to be emailed to us. The offer, counter offer and accpeted offer from CW. Right on the offer is the address of the owners of this home. I am going to knock on their door on Saturday and ask them if they are going to sign off on this.

Just another twist in this whole frustrating short sale process! I’m very confused as to why the realtor would not let us know that this was accepted.

@Wetsu

We are very fortunate to have a friend who is very high up in the company. We lived near one of the main offices of CW for many years. I wish I had a number or name to pass along but this person reached out for us as a personal favor.

Final Update:

After over 4 months our story has finally come to an end. We closed last Wednesday June 17th. The house is ours, we moved in over the weekend. We were in the situation where we could wait, but I know alot of you aren’t as fortunate. There were times when we wanted to move on, but we are so glad we stuck it out and couldn’t be happier with the place we got.

Good luck to all of you, hope you’re as fortunated as us!

One last IMPORTANT tip: It’s extremely important to have the seller’s agent or the person they hire to do the legwork with CW to be very diligent about contacting CW at least twice per week. In our case the seller’s agent had a lady from the title company take care of this responsibility, and I can’t say enough about the job she did, she was fantastic!!

@ Matt A

Where are you looking? It all depends on the area. The house we got that was just accepted was purchased and built in 06 for over 1 million w/out landscaping. Our offer was accepted at $675.
Have your Realtor run the comps in the area. You can also do some work yourself. I used redfin.com, cyberhomes.com and zillow. Redfin you have the option of putting in what has sold over the past few months. CW will accept an offer that is fair market. Ours was a bit under but they accepted.

It all depends on how much prices have dropped in the area you are buying. If it’s coastal prices have not dropped too much depending on what city.

Thanks Dave,

I just read our approval letter and it’s right there #10

Even after having our offer approved we are still in a nightmare. This is all dealing with the Realtor. Now I am worried about this!

I am even more confused than ever. I was on the realestate site last night, and noticed that the house we put the bid on is no longer listed. I checked a few other sites, and they all said the house is no longer on the market. I frantically emailed my realtor, who said that she spoke with the listing agent and they said we should have an answer this week. She also said that she checked the site and it said that the house is listed as sale pending. I did not see it anywhere listed as sale pending. What do I believe?

Thanks Dave, seems to me that you have been around the shortsale circus for quite sometime. I heard back from the realtor, seems that the bank has unoffically accepted our offer. They have pulled the listing and we are waiting for them to sign the papers. From the postings I have read, the deal often falls through at this point, but I still can’t help getting exciting. It seems that all I do is wait around every week to hear something from CountryWide.

Does anyone have any advice/experience about waiting period for CountryWide to sign papers after they accept an offer??

Oh no! Guess I shouldn’t start packing.

@ confuzed

I guess every one is different, we had our offer accepted and then closed within 2 weeks.

Good luck!

I’m in Colorado, I think it depends more on the people involved at every level being proactive, from the realtors, seller, title company, to the CW negotiators and staff involved in each individual SS deal.

Location … Location … Location…!

Lets assume they are 50,000 short sales a month in California being submitted to the Banks and 5,000 short sales being submitted to the banks from the midwest. Who do you think will get their short sale reviewed first?

Second … lets assume California, Las Vegas, Arizona, and Detroit were hit hardest with foreclosure and short sales. Where do you think majority of the long sales … ops short sale are going to come from? Is it going to be from the Midwest?

Third … ask yourself where majority of the people live? California vs Missouri? Las Vegas vs Iowa City? Arizona vs Oklahoma? Detroit vs St Louis?

Fourth … Location … Location … Location …! Why… It is more expensive to live in San Diego than Denver. Trust me. It is more expensive to live in San Francisco than St Louis. Trust me. Is it more expensive to buy a Penthouse in Las Vegas than in Oklahoma city. Trust me. There is a reason why more short-sales and foreclosure are visible in California, Arizona, Las Vegas … etc because it took more to buy something than in Denver.. than in St Louis .. than in Oklahoma City.

Fifth … Yes the individuals involved in the game also plays a role… Realtor, Banks, Listing Agent and you. If the listing agent has never done a short sale … take a wild guess … how long it take you to get the house. If your listing agent in not proactive (2 calls a day to Countrywide) Countrywide could careless.

Just a thought why the process of short sale is faster in some locations than in others.

@ John

I am in the same boat as you are with Countrywide. What is Ken Lewis email address?

Thank You John.

I would love to see your email to Ken Lewis at BofA. I have an offer on a short sale that’s been moving so slow legislation moves faster…it’s very frustrating.

I made my offer the last week of January 2009. A short sale file was opened the 2nd week of February. We had three Phase 1 negotiators. We were assigned a Phase 2 negotiator in May. We’re now on to the second Phase 2 negotiator. This one has not responded to any phone calls or emails. The file was escalated again, and the Seller’s agent received a response that she would try to get the file reviewed. The updates I receive are no more than the Sellers agent’s emails begging for status on the file. Each time the file is reassigned it appears timelines start over.

It would be helpful if their process would automatically escalate a file once hit a certain time frame. I realize the whole process is broken, but this is really awful.
It’s been five months heading into six months with no end in sight. I’m thinking sending an email to Mr. Lewis, but I’m not sure what kind of information to include to direct him to our particular case. Possibly the seller’s name or the address? Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks.

I have a question I haven’t seen addressed yet. I’ve just started looking for more in depth info on shortsales since we put in an offer on a house last week. Trust me, I’ve been doubtful of us getting this house before I signed papers but figured I had nothing to lose if we didn’t get it – I’ve been looking in this area for a while and don’t have a time constraint on when I have to move/buy, nor on having to qualify for a mortgage as my parents are writing me a mortgage (so I can close quickly- a plus??).

My question is – the house I put an offer on needs a LOT of work (plus previous people have left a LOT of stuff aka garbage/junk/drek/crap behind). The asking price that’s been placed on it is $129,990 – I offered $101,990. The house FMV from the county is $169,000 (the county has NO idea of it’s condition)

There are 2 homes in the subdivision for sale, of course, for more money, but they are move-in ready. My reasoning for offering the price I did was that I figured, from what I know, it would take about $40K for upgrades (possibly more) and repairs and I don’t want to go over $150K total. Whoever set this price of $129 – if an appraiser – do they take in to consideration all the work that needs to be done? If they do comps – how can they even compare houses without knowing what the inside looks like? Or does the listing agent make up this price with knowing the interior condition? Or did the current owner put this price?

I didn’t want to go for a house that was SS due to what little I had read, it just so happen that it was a SS. First they told me it was a foreclosure – some people think they are one in the same, but I knew they weren’t, taking on a short sale was a long sale process with lots of headaches and has many have said, little chance of it going through. After I did some “digging” I found it was a SS, not a foreclosure.

I’m sure an investor could do everything cheaper and thus, pay a little more for the property – they put in the cheapest of everything it seems whereas I am going to live in it and want to make my investment livable with what I want in it. I can’t see paying more for this house when I can probably find a house that needs less work for a bit more. I went ahead and placed the offer with the idea that I was leaving to go back home and wouldn’t be back for at least a month to look at more homes. There is a timeframe for my offer, so it can either be extended or withdrawn when the deadline comes up -which I’m sure the lader will happen.

I’m a firm believer, if it’s meant to be, it’s meant to be.

FYI I just found this after typing the above – it “seems” they request an interior appraisal – so if they take the counties FMV into consideration and they too think there’s $40K worth of repairs, I guess that may be how they came up with $129K? I’d much rather go with a house that needs less work=less headaches and spend a bit more. House would be nice once done, but I’m sure as there are many fish in the sea, there are homes to be bought!

https://customers.countrywide.com/secure/FHAStart_login254.asp

Thanks for any input you may have.

Thanks for the reply confuzed – I think we should ALL adopt your name!

Wouldn’t the bank have a BPO before putting it on the market? I’m trying to figure out exactly who set the price of $129K and their reasons for setting it at that price. I know my reasons for making the offer I did.

I know now, with more certainty than before, this deal will never go through, I put no hopes at all on this one, not after reading so much more about SS and Countrywide. There’s a reason for everything, I believe.

Thankfully, I’m only locked in to this deal for 2 weeks than I can get out of the contract. It’s up to me if I want to extend it or not – since I won’t be back up to that area until sometime in Aug. I can let it sit til then, but afterwards, I’ll just look for something else. No more SS for me!

I wonder when/if it goes in to foreclosure – do prices go down from what they’ve listed as a SS, meaning, is a foreclosure priced lower than it’s previous SS price if it didn’t sell?

Thanks!

Thanks Confuzed!

Can you tell me what they were asking on the house and what you offered? What kind of condition is the house in?

I’ll probably wait it out unless they say otherwise, at least til I go back up there the end of Aug/early Sept. (I live out of state) I have nothing to lose unless I see something on line that I just HAVe to send my Mom to go see. Not sure how many times and for what length I can keep extending the contract.

As for the listing agent – he told my realtor that they had another offer on the table, and investor who came straight to him – which equals a 6% commision vs a 3% splitting it with my realtor. He’d def. make more going solo unless this investor goes a lot lower than we did. I was told realtors know who to call when listing like these come up. Makes it hard for us “regular folks” to get a good house with people going in and trying to flip homes.

I guess we’ll just have to wait and see what happens, at least for now.

Thanks!

Made 150k offer for property listed 239k on 4/1/09, house needs new boiler and cosmetic work.
Citi approved offer 6/1/09 and was bumped to Fannie Mae for “final approval”.
We’ve been told every week since that final approval letter should come next week.
Anyone know typical timeline for Fannie Mae final approval in Maine??
If nothing in two weeks, looking for something else for kids before school starts.
Thanks in advance.

@ Logan T- I am totally admiring you for ditching your realtor. I wish I could. Although the listing agent is quite a piece of work too. She works for a national chain, but does a side thing with her son of buying distressed properties, fixing them, and then offering them up for lease to buy. The house we bid on has been pulled from the MLS, but after that the listing agent put it up on her own site!!! I told my realtor and she acted like it was no big deal. I feel like I am suck with this idiot who could give a shit less whether or not we get this house.

OMG, I feel so horrible for the lies and backstabbing you had to endure. I feel like lawyers and realtors belong in the same pile. I forgot to mention that ours told us we couldn’t afford the house because the yearly taxes were to high for us. I thought the number was high, called the county auditor and found out her number was wrong-by almost half. She has been less than honest the whole time. Thank God that my parents are savy and have helped us the whole time. I think I will definetly use your advice. I’ll let you know what happened.

We too received a verbal acceptance on June 26, but as of today have still not heard anything more. I don’t really know how it effects buyers in different parts of the country, California seems to be the worst.

Thanks for the replys again.

Okay, so, I just got a call from my realtor who said that the listing agent says the deal is “looking good.” This is 2 days after I wrote them (it’s a pair that work together) a letter telling them of all I’ve been reading about the nightmares of trying to buy a SS, esp. one through CW, and how I’m not hopeful at all that this will ever go through. BUT, since I wasn’t going to be back up there looking for a home til the end of Aug. I wanted to go ahead and extend the contract from the original 2 weeks we put on it previsouly. Figured I had nothing to lose, time is on my side for the moment.

It seems the listing agent requested a few more days, so we extended the contract til the end of the month.

Am I any more hopeful now – no. I just think it’s delaying the inevitable. How could something like this go through so quickly when everyone else is having such terrible delays? Why not just tell me the truth and what to expect?

I signed the original contract July 1st – I just can’t see where the listing agent is being on the up and up about all this “looking good” with all I’ve read. Really, what’s the possibility of this being “the one” that goes through. Again, I’m being VERY skeptical about this. I know, at the time I signed the contract, the listing agent mentioned to my realtor that the owner still had papers to sign, one being the hardship letter. How could this all be put through so quickly.

I feel a bit of a fool in more ways than one. If this is “the one” that goes through, the email I wrote made me look foolish, but on the other hand, if they are lying to me and jerking me around, I’ll feel like a fool for making me think that maybe, just maybe, this may go through in less than 6-8 months, if at all.

Really, what possible magic wand would this man have to get something like this through quicker than 99.9% of all the other deals? Of course, the possibility of him saying “it’s looking good” may mean that my paperwork is looking good to getting on to someones desk at CW and sit there until they reject my offer.

So, can anyone tell me why bother saying what he (the listing agent) is saying to me about it “looking good?”

Thanks!

Honestly, I can’t even imagine that they are going to be making that much money on this sale if it does go through. I don’t know what the fees are for a SS, but I’ve been working with these 2 ladies for quite a while now and they’ve definitely earned their money just driving me around looking at homes. Whatever commisions are made to the realtors involved, it can’t be much, especially when you start splitting it among those involved.

So Confuzed, if you got a verbal, what are they saying about why you haven’t received anything in writing yet?

I honestly don’t know why. The sellers agent says its the negotiator that is taking so long. My realtor calls her at least 3x’s a week just to check in and see how things are progressing. So far its our third week since we heard we have a verbal agreement. But there is nothing else on the market in our target area that we like, so we don’t mind the wait. Well, we don’t mind the wait as long as we get the house .

Congrats AJC – it gives many people hope to know there is hope out there. You know that old saying “Good things come to those who wait!”

Confuzed, hope you are the next to post that you got your letter!

Will post with any updates – and hope others do to, it helps to keep people updated on similar/familiar situations.

CONGRATS AGAIN!

No, I haven’t really guesstimated. Mainly because the things it needs are all cosmetic and not things that need to be fixed before we move in. There is wall paper and paint in the house that is not my taste. Same with some of the flooring, although it is newer. I would like to re-do the kitchen and bathrooms, but that because I watch way to much HGTV .

We are wating for an approval letter before we do inspections. I don’t know much about real estate law, but I would definitly get title insurance for your own peace of mind.

I tried to post some info from a website that suggests that HOA fees will not make a big difference in closing a short sale, but for some reason this website is holding my comming in “moderation?”

We signed docs last night. We should close on Tuesday.

We paid around $3,500.00 in HOA fees. The sellers had not paid in about a year so we had to pay plus all the late fees. Countrywide will not pay HOA fees. They split escrow fees with us and $500 for termite.

We closed on our house yesterday! We put in our offer in April and finally it’s ours! There were still people driving by and trying to get in last weekend and I’m so glad we were able to take down the sign. The realtors were too cheap to put up pending or sold on the sign out front.

The house was built in 06 and is totally upgraded with wood floors and high end appliances. Some of our neighbors paid twice as much in 06 with smaller yards. We have a big backyard with a view of a golf course and the hills so we can’t wait to design a lagoon style pool!

Hang in there everyone. Our experience was horrible and mostly because of the listing agent but in the end it was worth it!

Good luck to all of you.

@KuKu

It is my understanding that CW will only look at one offer. The whole process would have to start over from the beginning with a new offer. Why would the listing agent submit another offer? I would call them.

Congrats! I wish you and your family all the best in your new home!!

I really don’t think that there is a set turn around time on anything. Most of it determines what part of the country you are in and how many cases each negotiator is working. California seems to be the worst. Short sales can take 4-6 months on average with Countrywide. Also, threatening the bank generally doesn’t work, since they don’t care anyway. If they did care they would have closed your offer, my offer, and every other offer. I find that the most frustrating part of the process, the fact that they don’t give a crap. One more thing, although the bank is technically losing money, they also have the mortages insured and are not losing money like you would think.

Soooooo…after reading everyones good and bad comments on Countrywide, I get to tell our comment on them. My wife and I are celebrating our 6 month anniversary on the signing of the contract of a short sale home. Within the 6 months of waiting we have found out that short sales suck and are full of suprises. House had two loans on it and was through Aurora Loan Services. Received verbal acceptance on both loans at the end of May. Month later first loan written approval in the sellers hand but not the second. Found out that Aurora sold a BAD LOAN to COUNTRYWIDE during the process and no one had a fricken clue. Selling agent who is dumber than fu$#@ing bricks finally took over the file from the seller. He says he has been in contact with Countrywide and they are epediting everything…that was 3 weeks ago. Ohhhh…and both banks according the the selling agent says they are fighting over $500.00 …We said shit we’ll give you 500+an extra 300 to get the letter overnighted. Again we sit here in frustration continuing to look for other homes and somehow still get drawn to this SS house.

For all of us out there trying to help the economy by buying up these overpriced/crappy built homes, and getting screwed left and right by these banks just drives us nuts. Now I am not a huge fan of Obama whatsoever, but to hear him finally call out the banks the other day put a smile on my face, because YES the banks are the ones still screwing over the American people and the economy and they should be called out on it!

Ok enough of my rant. Just another frustrated homebuyer here.

PS: I thought buying a home should be simple like it used to be. You find a house, you put an offer on it, seller accepts, you get an appraiser, they come out and says ok price and comps are good(Another rant I can get on thanks to Mr. Cuomo), you get an inspector, get your financing, and close………..move on with your lives…

You know, I knew from the get-go that this would be long process. I was prepared for the wait. I was not, am not, prepared for all the sneaky, shadowy dealings that are the underbelly of short sales. A friend of the family who’s wife is a realtor, called us last night to tell us the house that we recieved verbal acceptance on is now relisted on the local MLS as active. Our realtor called the listing agent and she said the listed was about the be pulled because it had been listed as sale pending for so long, so she had to relist it as active. What? Why!!! I don’t get this at all. Any help from out there as to why from the purgatory that is short sale land?

The sellers agent smells like a rat, looks like a rat, and I’m guessing he is a rat. What did your agent say? I would contact a real estate lawyer and get some advice before I proceed. What happens if CW finds out, will they pull the contract?

Hello everyone!

I just thought I’d chime in on all the frustration with a happier note. My wife was handed the keys to our home 4 days before we hit the 6 month mark of putting in our original offer. I am writing this from the kitchen of our 2,400 sq. ft. home, up from the 800 sq. ft. apartment where my wife, 2 -year old daughter, and myself had been for the last 2 years.

In the last 2 months, I had wanted to strangle everyone at Countrywide/Bank of America for their lack of urgency and carelessness. In a way, I still do. It was an unneccesary waste of time and money and they have a long way to go before people respectfully start looking at them.

For those who have been waiting months, try to hang in there. It’s frustrating and mentally draining, I know. The bottom line is that we are right at the floor point of this market and if you can snag a home in the next couple of months, you can truly say you got the best possible deal, especially if it’s a distressed property. We bought our home for $365,000 less than what it sold for brand new in late 2005. The home is in immaculate shape and once the back lawn comes back, I will be very happy!

For those of you who plan on or are thinking of e-mailing Ken Lewis, do it as soon as you can, especially those who have been waiting 4 months and beyond. I just told him our situation, how long we’ve waited, and our desire to help the troubled real estate market while also making a dream a reality. Don’t write a sob story or kiss butt. Just be real, straight, and honest without directly ripping the company. I doubt you’ll get a response from Mr. Lewis directly, but there is a good chance you’ll get contacted by a representative of the Office of the Chair like I did. My guess is that she was either forwarded the e-mail by Mr. Lewis, or she is his personal assistant who reads his e-mails. Either way, she expidited the file for approval within 48 hours and we officially opened escrow.

Hang in there, folks. You’ll get the key eventually, even though it may never seem that way (that’s what I thought).

I like to hear a successful story through all of this garbage we have been fed. Thanks for your story and congrats!

I have also sent an email to the negotiator with no response (which i wasnt expecting). I have just sent an email to Mr. Ken Lewis, CEO of Bank of America, on a suggestion by John who recently had a success story. I am hoping for the best but again, not expecting anything. Thats the only way i can see your problem working, try going to the top. Maybe it will shake somethings up.

[email protected]

How did you find out the negotiators number and name? I want to do that. The listing agent will not talk to us, only our agent.

I would email them again, this time put kens email in the CC area so that they can see. If they think their managers and big bosses are watching, that may give them the incentive to look into your case.

Also, try Tammy Orcutt; [email protected]
MLO-SR LOAN SVCS SPECIALIST
EXECUTIVE CUSTOMER RELATIONS
SHORT SALE DEPARTMENT

I absolutely agree. Thats what we have decided to do as well. The problem with our area (Ohio) is that its the same old houses for sale that we don’t like. Maybe 1-3 new houses will come up every 2weeks, and most of those are short sales too.

Is tammy a regional negotiator? Do I need to find the MLO for my area?

@ Jag,
Where in the process did they give you “verbal acceptance” if any? Just wondering because we recieved verbal acceptance on June 26 and haven’t heard anything since.

Jag, thanks so much for sharing your experience. I must admit, I am more confused now than ever. Our agent said the sellers agent told her we had verbal acceptance. I am so dumbfounded. I don’t know what to do. We have consistantly kept an eye on the market, but there is nothing else we like. Threatening to walk does no good, since they don’t care. I have emailed everybody that previous posters said to email, all to no avail. I am at a total loss of what to do; other than twiddle my thumbs.

This is getting more irritating by the day. Here have been my email updates and i have no idea how much longer it will take.

Offer submitted- Mar 7

BPO’s done- Early May and agian Early June b/c they sat on it so long.

June 7- Signed closing date addendum to recieve answer by July 7 and close date of August 7 per countrywide. Countrywide also requested sellers information.

July 10 email update-

“Please refer to my previous email for the information I need to help you
move this along. As for a time frame, now that I am actively working
this case it should hopefully take no more than 45 days. I apologize for
the delays on this case, but looking forward I will do everything I can
to get this to closing for you.

Thanks!”

July 23 email update-

“All docs requested for this have been received. The BPO’s have been
delivered. All info has been updated/uploaded to our database. This file
is now ready for phase 2.

Thanks! ”

August 4 email update-

“This case has been submitted to phase two. In phase two another
negotiator will be assigned to this case and it will be submitted to the
investor for an approval request. There has been some delay in this
assignment process due to the amount of other cases. Thanks for your
continued patience.

- Mark ”

How much longer do i have to wait? This is beyond rediculous. They just keep telling us the same thing over and over again! Is there a light i should be looking for?

Someone please give me some hope.

@ Jag

When did you get told it was ready to submit to investor? And did the seller have all there paperwork turned in during phase 1?

For me they have all the paperwork they need. So i have no idea what else the phase 2 neg. will need to do except submit the package.

@ Frustrated Firefighter

Was told the package was ready to be submitted to investor August 4, 2009. Yes the seller did submit all there paperwork during phase 1.

Frustrated Firefighter see my response to confuzed (August 5,2009) and it will answer some of your questions and confuzed.

@Jag, I really don’t know how to thank you enough! You have definitely opened the process up and allowed me a peek into what is going on behind the slow, slow process. Again thank you so much for taking the time to lay it out so clearly.

I am frustrated to know I am back at Phase 2 again after having been there once. This is starting to remind me of Monopoly and I keep getting sent back to jail without passing Go!

Thanks again and be sure to keep us posted with the process on your house.

@ Sarah

If ANY lender on the loan is Countrywide (irrespective of 1st, 2nd, ….9th lender) the process is still the same. Countrywide has to still approve the 15k that it will accept. If not the junior lender (Countrywide) will come after the buyer/seller for deficiency judgment. GOT-TO GOT-TO MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY OR ELSE.

@ Confuzed

(1) How did you find out if the package was submitted to the investor?
(2) When did you initially sign the purchase agreement?
(3) Do you know or read up on how long the investor has until he makes a decision on a short sale – your mentioned 6 weeks – where did you get that information?

I am in the same boat as you are…My package was submitted to investor August 4, 2009 and had signed the purchase agreement on March 14, 2009. So curious to see if the time frame was the same.

Hello All –

Finally closed on my condo, SS with CW took four months. In the end, I received lots of credits at closing. Condo sold to me for $7,000 less than the asking price! I got lots of perks on the deal. I was as patient as I could be, this forum definitely helped me through the last four to six weeks of the SS process. CW is a mess, but now I am soooo happy!!

@ confuzed….

I received well over $6,000 in credits. Was able to walk away with over half of my downpayment, two months association dues, 105% real estate taxes and a few other things that worked well in the end. Four months of frustration….I am pleased with the end result!!!

@KuKu….I am in Illinois. If the place is worth it, stay with it. My attorney and real estate agent were great. I voiced my concerns (gripes) with this process to them every week. Whenever they received information, they made it a point to let me know. Pretty much we were at the mercy of CW the whole time. Keep getting those updates even though the update will seem cryptic. I don’t think I’ve done anything too much different than everyone else in this forum!

Normally how long does it take for a decision from the investors once the short sale has been submitted?

@ Jag, just wondering, but are you a private detective? So, I guess our house must be with fannie may and freddie mac since we are waiting on the investor. Agghhh, the government! This could be a very long wait!

@ confused

The same day I threatened to squash the deal was the same day I received notification the file was with the investor. I suppose once they saw how frustrated I was, I only waited 2 weeks from that point.

How do you determine who your investor is?

Sorry for the late response.

I see I have alot people asking questions so let me answer them.

1. I am the buyer and not the seller. True … only the seller’s agent can call Countrywide or the negotiator and get update. There is a form which countrywide needs to authorize the agent to act on behalf of the seller and as such seller’s agent can then talk to Countrywide … common sense. But what if your agent – buyers agent – also has that authorization? Wait a second are you telling me both the seller and buyer’s agents have authorization to speak to Countrywide and the negotiator? YES. How can that be? Very simple … look folks …. Countrywide could careless if you walk or not. They have 10 million short sales to deal with. Your short sale is meaningless to them. You need to put presure on Countrywide to act on the file. How can you do that? Have both buyer and seller’s agent HARASS THE NEGOITATOR. How badly do you want the house? If you do, then have the buyer’s agent obtain authorization from seller so that your agent puts presure on the negotaitor along with sellers agent. This way you are informed of what is going on rather than waiting on sellers agent to update you on it.

2. @ Confuzed no I am not a private detective just a mild manner buyer looking for a shetler over head.

3. @ Lynette – If the investor is a government agency (Fannie Mac and Freddic) then by law they can disclose the agency. If the investor is a non-government agency they do not have to disclose it. Chance are your investor is BONY – The Bank of New York Mellon – Countrywide was heavily involved servicing there loans.

4. I have learned something else which I would like to share with my bloggers. If you submitted offer on a short sale between March – June 1, 2009 chances are that you are still waiting for approval. Why? As you know Countrywide was bought by Bank of America. Countrywide used a different system for data entry then does Bank of America. The information they had entered at the Countrywide between March -June 1, 2009 had to be re-entered starting June 2, 2009 with Bank of America on there system. Your file probably had to be closed with Countrywide and reopened on the Bank of America system. So what does mean to you? Nothing was being done on your file while the merger was being completed. So the time spend waiting for approval between March – June is not counted toward your short sale. Since nothing was being done on your file.

@Jag: thanks for posting the investor info. My husband and I made an offer of $305K on a Countrywide short sale back in mid January 2009. We got word approx a month later from the Phase 1 negotiator that our offer was rejected so we bumped it up to $315K. Our $315K offer then went to Phase 2. On Wed, Aug 5th we were contacted by the Phase 2 negotiator with a counteroffer of $325K and instructed to submit an ammended purchase contract and new HUD by Fri, Aug 7th. We accepted the counteroffer and everything was emailed that Friday morning and the seller’s agent got a “Thank You” email from the Phase 2 negotiator acknowledging receipt of the documents. We haven’t heard anything since. Since the Phase 2 negotiator counteroffered, does this mean the investor is not federal? Do you know approx how long we should expect to wait for the final approval? They counteroffered, we accepted… are we at the end now?

@ Jag: Good Luck! I’ll keep you posted on our progress… hopefully we hear something soon. )

I have a question. We put an offer in on a short sale, the bank counter and we accpted the counter we are waiting on the bank sign off on the offer we accepted how long do we have to wait.

@ Christina

A counter offer is a new offer which needs approval from the investor. You could receive a response as early as within a day or within 30-45 days. Christina can you provide a dateline when you submitted the offer including dates when things transpired.

Well i just received word that country wide countered our offer with an offer 30k above our original offer. Well the listing agent was so mad that she started yelling at country wide about how they just sold a house right down the road for a lot cheaper. So while I was on the phone discussing what we were going to do with my fiance, country wide called the agent back and offered a price 15k over our offer. We now countered that with a slightly lower offer and i hope to hear back today but you never know. At least something is happening.

Oh and all those emails i wrote to the CEO and all the other execs. I just got an email back yesterday that said they cant discuss anything with me unless i get a letter from the seller stating that thet are allowed to discuss it with me. So it seems as if nothing really helped except for time. I sent at least 4 emails over the past two months to the CEO and just now receiving a response and then to all the execs with no response.

Well, we continue to wait with a slightly better outlook. Thats our update. Anyone else hear anything?

@ Honiee

Do you know when the agent sent in the HUD and purchase contract? It turns out that our negotiator went home early so we couldn’t receive and answer but the country wide people told the agent to start drawing up the paperwork under our counter offer price. So I hope to hear on Tuesday.

How do I get on this website?

I also am involved with Countrywide on a short sale. This website has really helped with additional information. I was told by the realtor I am in Phase 2, my offer has been sent to a second negotiator and we should hear back in three to five days, that was the first week of August. Last week my realtor was told not to call back until after Sept. 14th.
There was an appraisal of the property done in March 09,(I beleive that is the same as the BPO) countrywide stated what they wanted for the property, at this point the buyers walked away because it was 7 months later. Thats when we came in and made an offer May 09, close to the asking price.
I was wondering if the home is appraised for less then the offer, does countrywide allow you to purchase for the appraisal amount? Does anyone know?
Does it sound like we are getting close? This is a very frustrating ! Thank you to anyone who can offer any advice.
georgepa

Now I understand that everyone has beed waiting awhile to close after receiving verbal acceptance. Well our offer was accepted yesterday and countrywide informed the realtor that it will take 2-5 days for the contract to go to fannie may for there approval and then it would come to me for my signature. As soon as I sign, they said i have 30 days to close. So i have 30 days to get a inspection and appraisal. I ‘m not expecting it to happen too fast so i am wondering if anyone else has heard this or has a timeline for how things are going for them.

Still want to here some updates.

My real estate agent also informed us if we receive an approval we would have 30 days to close.

We made an offer on May 12th , as far as we know we are in Phase 2, the second mediator was suppose to contact the real estate agent within a couple of days that was the second week of August. When the agent called the mediator, he was told not to call back until Sept. 14th. My agent was the one who told us we are getting close, once the offer is accepted, we we have an inspection done and then have 30 days to obtain a mortgage and close. I don’t really know if it will work that way, I hope so. We are running short of time for the tax rebate , which is Nov 30th.
We are just about at 4 months since we started this process, very frustrating.
georgepa

Has anyone here Sold a home using the Countrywide short sale process? My wife sold one a couple of years ago, and the second chunk of the 80/20 is still on her credit. Countrywide says they have no paperwork, but it must be correct… The Company that worked the shortsale went under, so no paperworking coming from them. Anyone had any issues, or better yet found a solution?

@Jag
Thanks for your comment. Reading others comment and shortsale experience helped me lots!

@WorriedVetWife

Would you believe we have been waiting since March 14, 2009. We must have asked to escalate our offer about 70 times. We kept pushing and pushing to the point we began to harass the negotiator. Legally and mentally we are guilty of harassment. Unfortunately it still took that long.

Now WorriedVetWife …. I am going to be honest with you and tell you up front that you will NOT make the November deadline. Why? Based on your date schedule it is still tooo early in stage 2. No New HUD statements have been forwarded to the negotiator, no updated bank statements have been forwarded, buyers information has not been forwarded, buyers preapproval letter has not been forwarded and on on. This usually occurs at the end of stage 2. After all that then they start to review the file and then you enter counteroffer/ then 30 day closing which put you into December.

I will keep everyone as we head toward a answer.

@ Tired of Waiting

If your short sale is subject to lender approval then how has it been approved? According to your statement ” my offer was accepted on July 9 subject to lenders approval.” Confusing. If the underlying investor has not approved the short sale than who has accepted the short sale? Bank of America/Your Seller/Countrywide/Your Agent means nothing if they accepted the short sale. ONLY WHEN THE INVESTOR SAYS YES AND ONLY THEN YOUR SHORT SALE HAS BEEN APPROVED. Bank of America/Countrywide are servicer of the loan. They cannot approve the short sale. Your Seller nor your agent can approved the short sale. So who’s left? INVESTOR.

Typically Bank of America orders two BPO’s based on my experience. First when the short sale is submitted at stage 1 and then reorders the BPO in stage 2 if the first BPO is older than 60 days from second BPO. If Tired of Waiting Bank of America has ordered only one BPO then you still have a while to go.

But stay in there. I know you are upset that why is it taking this long. Based on what you said chances are things will pick up within couple of weeks when they start to request revised HUD statements, buyers information … etc.

Hello,
My Fiance and I put a offer in on a countrywide shortsale on April, 25. W have been very Patient with this whole process thinking theres no way we could miss the nov, 31 deadline for the tax credit. Now were getting worried, our agent is not experinced in shortsales and we are gerrting mixed information from her.

1. our agent says we are in contract with countrywide and cannot make aany other offers without looseing our contract.

2.We’ve tried to find out what phase of the process we’re in but all we get is phase 2, we’ve bee told were in phase 2 since june.

3. the sellers agent says our negotiator has sent the offer to the second mortage and investors.

My question is, how much longer do we have to go and how can we speed up the process.

We were told by the sellers realtor that the second mortgage approval will take 5-10 business days. The second mortgage is for 75,000. Would they really take only 3,000?? We waited 30 days to get the first mortgage short sale approval.

APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED
APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED APPROVED

Our short sale has been approved September 14, 2009. Our short sale has been approved September 14, 2009. Our short sale has been approved September 14, 2009. DO I NEED TO SAY IT ANYMORE…..!

Submitted Short sale agreement March 14, 2009 was assigned Phase 1 Negotiator June 5, 2009 and Phase 2 Negotiator August 4, 2009. Submitted to investor for approval August 21, 2009 and received written confirmation September 14, 2009 short sale approval. I am the buyer and my seller are thrilled at the news.

@ Frustrated Firefighter

I never received verbal acceptance. Seller’s agent received phone call and faxed letter of approval and the original is in mail. Anticipated closing date September 18, 2009. As for what process remains (a) final walk through the house (b) document signing (c) picking up the keys.

Congrats to both of you, Jag and Honiee. I am encouraged by your good news.
Did you receive any counter offer or the bank approved your orginal offer? What State are you in?

I received NO counteroffer. Submitted offer for $320,000 back on March 14,2009 and they accept $320,000 without counter offers. I am in Northern California.

Congrats “Jag” Im happy for you. What I was talking about that you were confused on was that Im under contract on the home that Im trying to purchase. I’ve been under contract for 10 weeks now but Im still waiting for the banks approval on this sale. The sellers agreed to the price that Im willing to pay on the house, now Im waiting for BoA to approve it . A third party(quantum realestate solutions) is taking care of the short sale process and we are now on the third phase. My real estate agent said, that everything looks good and that we are waiting for the negotiators on this last phase. He also said that we can probably close by mid Oct.

Congrats Again very happy for you. What State are you in? Im in Chicago I just hope within the next week I get the same news as you.=)

Thanks, Jag & Honiee. All the best.

Dear Bloggers:

It literally took exactly 6 months to the date (march 14 till September 14) to get an approval. This is the trend for California. Not sure other parts of the Country. Honiee will be better to gauge for those in east coast.

Having said that … during our ordeal like most of you we looked at other homes and put offers on other properties, were upset why did we ever saw the house we fell in love with, fought with our agents, with spouse and Ken Lewis. You name it and chances are we are probably going through the same headaches.

It did us no good to get mad. It does good to put pressure on the negotiator. True patient is a virtue but even that got cold and old. But stay in their my flew Countrywide defectors. It will work. It will work. It will work. It will work for you. And when it does the past 6 months will seem meaningless.

GUESS WHAT PEOPLE!!!! I GOT MY HOUSE, I WAS TOLD TODAY. THEY HAVENT TOLD ME A CLOSING DATE BUT THEY SAID IT WILL BE APPROXIMATELTY THE FIRST WEEK OF OCT. HURRAY.

@ JAG AND FRUSTRATED FIREFIGHTER, I TOLD YOU I WAS IN PHASE THREE FINALLY, IT TOOK ME TWO IN A HALF MONTHS TO GET AN ANSWER. GOOD LUCK TO ALL. FRUSTRATED FIREFIGHTER, YOU WILL GET YOUR HOUSE. GOOD PEOPLE, DESERVE GOOD THINGS AND YOU WILL GET YOURS.=)

hey guys, thought i’d join the discussion…
we submitted an offer on a CY short sale around a month ago. we got word that “a negotiator was assigned” about 2-3 weeks ago. Not sure if that’s a level 1 or level 2 negotaitor. Since then we haven’t heard anything (not that i’ve expected to). The house originally was set to go to foreclosure on Aug 30th and they got it pushed back to Sep 30th – that’s been the main thing I was worried about. I don’t know if its typical for them to just keep pushing the date back… anyone have any experience w/ that?
We’re not expecting to make the 8k tax credit deadline – we’re just considering that to be an added bonus if it happens, but i’m putting the changes down at 10%.

Hey again! So we actually heard a response today – the bank outright rejected our offer. They had apparently ordered a BPO and said our offer was too low. Any suggestions on what to do here? I wish they had countered instead. We may increase our offer by $15-20k to give it one last shot. The only positive thing out of this is that we got our response from them about a month from submitting our offer.

They wont tell the sellers agent the price. Most of these agents are just concerned with trying to get these houses off of their list. With that being said, most sellers agents will try to work with the buyer as much as they can to finalize this deal as it is just as frustrating for them. This is why countrywide wont tell them. It puts them in a bad negotiating position. Our sellers agent tried many times to get the info from the multiple BPO’s that were accomplished. Sorry, i would just say try to get it as close to fair market price as possible.

Is there any rule of thumb for how much of a loss banks are usually willing to take? We upped our offer 20k so it’s now slightly above the most recent listing price of the house, but that’s still about 45-50k less than the total loan on the property. How much does the foreclosure process cost the bank?

Received formal approval letter today!!!!
We now have 30 days to close. YAAAAAAAY!

Gratz!!! Gratz!!! Gratz!!!

gratz!!!!!!!!

HI, IN MY OPINION FROM WHAT YOUR SAYING, IT LOOKS GOOD. I THINK THAT IF BOA WASNT GOING TO ACCEPT YOUR OFFER, THEY WOULDNT SPEND THE MONEY AND DO ANOTHER BPO. IT LOOKS LIKE YOUR IN STAGE 2, ALSO I THINK YOU WILL MAKE THE CUTOFF DATE THATS 9 WEEKS AWAY AND IN 9 WEEKS A LOT CAN HAPPEN. GOOD LUCK

The sellers agent can’t seem to get the 1st negotiator to respond (by email or phone). The way we found our our 1st offer was rejected was just through a generic call center and file status lookup. Any suggestions here? B/c apparently our new and improved offer is just going back to the same negotiator , so that has me a bit worried.

@ Worried Vet Wife

To answer your question it will be a close call. Remember they are so many factors still involved (a) what if they counter offer you then time will be wasted (b) appraisal will take few days for the funding of the loan (c) underwriter needs time to get the documents ready for escrow (d) recording and on and on. I do pray that you close tomorrow morning. But keep in there. I have faith you are close.

Add ing a coborrower to the loan should be pretty simple to do with the loan that is currently in process. However, keep in mind that, unless it’s an FHA loan, YOU still have to qualify for the majority of the loan. FHA is the only loan that allows a “non-occupying coborrower” to bear the weight of the total debt. Just an FYI…..I am a 36 year veteran mortgage banker.

@CJae

You mentioned about the mortgage insurance company having a sat so. Well it just so happens that is exactly where we are right now. The seller has approved and signed off, the lender has approved and signed off, and now it is with the mortgage insurance company and CW is being optimistic about it getting approved from them and we hope to hear on Monday. Once we do we then have 30 days to close. Now why does this need to go to the mortgage insurance company for approval. This is the only step that confuses me and i just found out about it last week when i signed the addendum so it can be submitted for this last step. C/W said that once this gets back that we’re done. Just curious b/c i never had heard this before. Thanks

@ Frustrated Firefighter and Moose:

Frustrated Firefighter … Moose is right. PMI – property mortgage insurance – usually plays a roll in approving the short sale. So let me give an example.

Suppose you have a house and the loan on it is $50. You try to short sale it for $20. The loss to the bank is $30. If the bank foreclose on the property then the PMI company MUST reimburse the bank for $30. However, a short sale is not a foreclosure but a pre-foreclosure. The PMI company is NOT obligated to reimburse the bank for $30. It is at a discretion of the PMI company to cover the bank. If the bank will not be reimbursed for the loss chances are the bank will not approve the short sale.

From what the seller’s agent tells us, we are in the third stage, they are waiting to hear back from the investor. Any idea how long that takes.

If your offer has not been approved then you are either in phase 1 or 2. If you are in Phase 2 then you most likely have at least another two months before you close. Once your offer gets accepted you are looking at anywhere from two weeks to two months to close due to the paperwork needing to get signed, depending on how many people need to sign it.

Our offer was approved by Countrywide, but now we are faced with a bank that has a second mortgage and they won’t agree to the payoff Countrywide is willing to pay them. Anyone else hear of this? Shouldn’t this be between Countrywide and the other lender? The realtor who represents us as the buyer and the seller is trying to negotiate with the other lender. We began this process in May, it took 5 months for Countrywide to agree to our offer, and request a closing date in 30 days, now this obstacle. This is the most frustrating process I have ever gone through. Any advice ????

We were told two weeks ago that we should have a response on our offer by October 16th. It’s October 18th and still no response. I don’t know why they give deadlines and then break them. All I can say is pray hard. Hope you get an answer soon!

For those who have been through a successful short sale process …
After the bank approves an offer, how quickly do they send a letter/contract showing their approval and the closing date, etc?

Question for you – I made an offer on a short sale, BPO has been don and submitted to the lender a couple of weeks ago and they’ve confirmed that they received the BPO. I just received notice that the short sale package has been submitted to a closer for a retail market review and that the listing agent should be hearing from the closer at the bank. Is a closer someone that closes the deal or is it another negotiator to deal with and more hoops to jump thru?

Thanks

I posted earlier this year about CW/BOA short sales. I would completely avoid them if possible.
If I were a Seller facing foreclosure with CW/BOA, I’d talk with a bankruptcy attorney.
Please note: I and my network do many, many short sales and with all other banks, I’d still pursue a short sale. CW/BOA is the one exception. We will no longer touch one – and that’s saying something.
If I were Buyer looking at a CW/BOA short sale, unless I absolutely Had to have That house, I’d move on and buy something else – or, wait for it to get foreclosed on and buy it when it comes back on the market as REO (real-estate-owned aka bank-owned). I’d likely get a better price and I’ll avoid the headaches.
However, for those of you who are already in one and don’t want to walk away, here’s a couple of internal phone numbers that might help… These came through a lot of blood, sweat and tears so you Know I’m getting out since I’m coughing up hard-earned info:
800-669-2443
800-601-2522 x2773 (office of the chairman, customer advocate)
800-601-2522 x8575 (office of the chairman, customer advocate)
Also, if you have a file in Level 3 status, here’s a supervisor:
[email protected] — but this is only useful for files in Level 3. You’ll notice, though, that for BOA, if you have someone’s first & last name you can likely send them an email.
Good luck.

Yup, walk away.
That aside, no, it’s the responsibility of you or your agent or the seller or their agent to get the second to take CW’s offer. A very common number these days is $3000 to the second.
You can ask CW to extend, they’ll likely ask you to pay money up front – I’d suggest you don’t. They still may extend.
BTW, make sure your title insurance company is okay with clause #10 in CW’s approval letter — if it’s there.

If the short sale hasn’t been approved then you don’t have any deal yet, simple as that. The sellers could be “ready” to close today for all they care, and you could be “ready” to move in, but unfortunately it’s a multi-step process you have to go through to get it approved first.

GOT THE LETTER TODAY WOOHOO

Our 1st offer was rejected after 2-3 weeks. We upped the offer and that one took about 1.5 months until final approval. The looming foreclosure date wasn’t necessarily all good b/c we kept having to request extensions of the date and that was a bit nerve-wracking and uncertain each time.

HI,

We put an offer on a house at the end of August. We got confirmation back that they recieved all the paperwork 2 weeks later…(it was delayed a little because the listing agent needed to resend the HUD-1) and was even assigned to a level 1 negotiator in early to mid Sept. Now it is the beginning of Nov and they still have not ordered a BPO or an appraisal. I read the BOA site and it stated that it will only be ordered if they think a short sale can actually occur. Now we really love love love this house. We have looked at a ton of others and nothing really compares. We have tried to call the listing agent to put pressure on her and she keeps saying that she is calling a leaving messages, but never has a response. and then goes on to say how bad it is over there ect….Any suggestions? We have already asked to be added to list that can call but they have said no. We offered above the lisitng price, so it is not like it is a low-ball offer. Does anyone have any suggestions or does it look like this house won’t go through because they haven’t even ordered the BPO?
We got a decent offer on our house and have a 2 month rent back. I just don’t know if we should sell if this house will take more than 3 or 4 months……(the pain of moving into a rental until we figure out if we will even get this house) AGHHHHHHH!

I haven’t heard of this yet on the blogs. Long story short, our offer was approved and the second lender also approved a payoff. Now we are at the stage of inspection, co, and closing. The inspection went really bad, the house flooded from the last time I saw it. The house has been empty for almost a year. Now we have flood damage, lots of mold, old electrical wiring that needs to be replaced, and the list goes on and on. So now we go back to the bank to take money off. The repairs are very costly and the price is not worth it anymore. Anyone else experience this? Are you supposed to get an inspection before an offer is accepted. Could I be the only one with this kind of luck?

having said that, some people do go ahead and do an inspection first so that they can find any problems and incorporate that into their offer price along w the inspection report…. but I’d say that’s the minority of cases.

Hi, everyone! Does anyone know how long it takes for freddie mac to approve a short sale. Its been 4 1/2 months and my file is in freddie mac’s hands, Im frustrated and I want to be in my house for the holidays. Can anyone help?

Hi, Moose its been with Freddie Mac for 6 weeks. The sellers mortgage insurance approved the sale so now its all up to Freddie mac. The sellers already moved out of the house this last weekend. Im just tired just like everyone here. Its just tiring when you here the same thing from you realtor over and over and over again.

Also, while dealing with Countrywide – My file went to a ‘Work Out Specialist’ and then three weeks later was with a Negotiator. Is the work out specialist the 1st negotiator? Does this mean I am with the 2nd negotiator now or am I being too hopeful?

I hate b of A and CW

We got a approval 2 1/2 weeks ago… this is after a long 5 1/2 month epic, and were told we would have a letter within 48 to 72 hours. uh, maybe they meant days. still hopeful though! anyone have this experience? a friend of mine has been waiting 2 months for his letter (:

@ stressed out; we did the same thing… sold our house, the same week we put an offer on the house above, stayed in our sold house for 2 months, guess what? we’re renting a 2/1 w/family of 4 now, on our 3rd month. but as for us we love the house we put an offer on and are willing to take the pain and chance. I think that is something you have to weigh out. BTW we also looked at others, probably over 1000 on line, and nothing compares to the one we have the offer on. so… we wait. and wait. as for putting pressure on. in certain instances I think it’s appriate others it’s like you’re in the airport waiting for the plane, pressure all you want, it will get there when it gets there!

hanginthere!

Closed this morning! Entire process took aboutttt 3 months. And to those who asked recently, it took about 1.5 weeks to get the written approval letter after the initial email/verbal approval. They said it would take 3-5 days… so took a bit longer than that. They were almost late approving the final HUD too… that happened literally 5 minutes before closing started… even though we sent it to them 5 days early.

I also have a short sale that just got approved by Bank of America but now the file is being sent to Freddie Mac, the investor, for their approval. Does anyone know how long investor approval takes? The bank told the agent only a few days, but I’m not sure. Does anyone have experience with this?

Just want a update from freakin BofA

Any info?

@Hanginthere Congratulations! We are definitely hanging in there for the house. There was no activity for 30 days so we had called to have it escalated and they were going to move it to another negotiator, but then the first negotiator called back and said that the file was complete and was moving it up to the phase II negiotiator and that we would be assigned one within the next two weeks. You’ve just given me some hope that we might actually get the house if we wait for it….we are going to end up renting, but our biggest fear is that we are waiting for the house and we might not actually get it.

To: Lacy for me its been 5 months and I still havent heard anything so unfornately to say you have a long time for an approval, but I think if you really like the house its well worth the wait.

To: Dreamer, I probably didn’t explain my first comment well my short sale has taken a total of 3+ mths but the phase 2 negotiator states its been with investors since oct 23rd which makes it 5 wks now with investors! Do you know what stage yours is in? Did I mention I hate BOA lol!

hmm sounds a bit weird… there should have been an estimated HUD with the initial submittal and review. the final HUD approval is done right before closing. The approval of hardship should have been done during the initial review I would think. Usually once its back from the investor it’s either approved or rejected… not sure what still has to be reviewed. But I am no expert..

To: moose, my realtor says what she thinks is that the investors gave the bottom dollar amount they would except and now BOA has to send it to a final negotiator but she is also confused as to why they are asking about HUD and hardship! I think the negotiator never sent it to investors but my realtor has all the emails saying it was with investors but she says when she calls the main line to check the status it says no new updates since nov 2nd but she has plenty of emails from the negotiator since then! I’m ready to fly to BOA myself and demand an answer lol! Oh well it is what it is but I told my realtor it was time to escalate or talk to a supervisor no more nice guy bshit!

Well typically the only underwriter is the person approving YOUR loan to buy the house on YOUR end of things (whever you are getting your mortgage from). The BOA guys should just be negotiators who are reviewing and hopefully approving the offer, not doing any underwriting. So it sounds like there’s some missing information there.

To:M&M, in my situation the phase 2 negotiator examined my appraisal and made sure it was in line with the net proceeds the bank or investors have to receive and then supposively was sending it to investors but I’m not so sure if she did that because now she’s changing her story!

To: M&M, You are probably right by thinking the underwriter is the investors because I researched it to and an underwriter is the final approval on like a loan application! These banks don’t have a clue what there talking about they said mine was back from the investors but they had to review the hud and hardship again that was suppose to be done @ the beginning of the process! I’m fed up with all these games but were in a position where we do have time to wait december 11th will be 120 days of this mess! I’m praying for everyone on this blog I really hope all of our dreams come true good luck everyone and GOD BLESS!

That fear is something we lived with, and somewhat still do until I get that key!

Try to make sure you are the only buyers. I asked time and again (and made sure) that we were the only offer and would remain the only offer. A friend of mine bought a SS with a higher offer at the last minute, kicking 4 other offers off the table who waited 4+ months.

If you have a lot of cash from the sale of your other house, that puts you in a very good postion. Make sure the seller agent knows you are committed with a big down payment. I learned early on, cash is king!

Blessings!

Well no call from the negotiators supervisor like I’m really surprised! Oh well I didn’t get my hopes up my poor realtor did though I got to where I really don’t care anymore december 11th will be four mths since we signed contract. When we first started this thing I stayed positive even after all the negative blogs I would read now I realize that its ok to be positive but you have to think realisticly and be patient because it is a very very long process! I think I went insane the first 3 mths and I just now made it to patient!

@hanginthere Thanks for the advice. We are definitely the only ones with offers in. We made sure of that in the beginning. We’ve told the sellers agent that we have a huge down payment ready, but she said we are still int eh same boat since they assumed we had it when we put the offer in.
I think you are right about the fear being there until we get the keys. The good news is that they finally ordered a BPO..after 3 months! The listing agent told our agent that it went well, so I guess we just wait until the next step! How long did it take you after your BPO to get the approval? Thanks!

@ stressed out: My husband makes fun of me and calls me a short sale addict cause I’m addicted to reading blogs on ss! There is no timeline after your bpo I’m sorry it just depends every ss is different I always thought by reading these blogs I would get some sort of time estimate but unfortunately you start to realize there isn’t one! The banks are so swamped right now that there gonna lie to you just to make it through another day. I think my bpo was done in september and we still haven’t heard any reply I wish you the best of luck I hope you get your house!

Hi, everyone today makes 5 1/2 months and still nothing waiting for Freddie Mac. I dont understand whats taking so long. At the 2 1/2 month mark the mortgage insurance approved the sale. Therefore, they will pay the difference so whats the hold up. Im tired of hearing the same story over and over again. Give me some good news already ughhhh!!

In our case, I didn’t hear any talk of it ever going to the investor. I didn’t even hear about a BPO being done for sure… after it was sent to the 2nd negotiator the next thing we heard was a verbal or unofficial email approval. Then about 1.5 weeks later we got the official approval letter (also sent by email but was in an official attachment form). So in our case, the last few steps actually did move fairly quickly. So it could be possible, but do NOT get excited until you see that final letter.

@stressedout, we had two bpo’s. one in the beginning and one about where you are. the reason was b/c it had been 3 mts and the market in FLA is shifting quickly. plus the first one was a drive-by, the 2nd was a little more detailed. then we had 2 more mts before our verbal, and 1.5 mts till our written, then 14 days to close! (see below for update)

But it sounds like you are on the right track still! so hang in there, I pray you can change your name to ‘not so stressed out’ one day!

Lacy, sounds like you’re on the slow track too but at least you’re on the dance floor. the blogs are addicting but I think they help, this one especially.

BOA/CW is absolutely swamped with ss’s. in the beginning or our trip, in may 09, I was told there were 100K houses in their hopper so it takes time.

my update is a closing on Monday 12/14 (God willing)! I am so psyched about it. we absolutely love this house even though it’s a major fixer-upper! we’re on a canal, I bought a kayak today for a great deal, we bought all new appliances on BLK Friday, saved about 2K, I am wheeling & dealing with roofers, floor refinishers, kitchen ppl, bath ppl, pool ppl, you name it! but I love it! We are so blessed to be able to (OK not yet) call this house our home! Well worth the wait!

@hanginthere – I hope your closing went well today! Hopefully everything went smoothly!
Lacy, that is exactly the same way I feel. To have waited this whole time only to get a no for an answer. Apparently, we do have an approval letter but they are still unable to open it to see if the terms are acceptable to the seller. They have not been able to contact the closer or anyone in BOA who can resend the file! Isn’t that crazy?!?! Another day of waiting to see where we stand…its almost worse because I had written off knowing for another two months.

Thanks for asking. Yes we did close today, we have our house! But not without a hitch. we were on our way from closing and got a call from the lender saying they had my wife’s name spelled wrong and could not wire the funds. So we u-turned back to title and long story short (oh bad pun) we got a call three hours later saying we own the house! WOW I can’t believe it. So I went to the house, hacked at bushes and vines, scraped some popcorn from ceilings, and met a neighbor. it is weird to be a neighbor again.

Yes the fears, the frustrations, they are real and everyone goes through it.

Afterthefact, our title agent said she’s done w/BOA, she turns down ppl who are mean in any way, my realtor absolutely hates ss’s. It’s not their fault, it’s a faulty system that is broken. it’s a serious problem, not just for buyers but everyone involved. so be nice, firm but nice.

I chose ‘hang in there’ b/c i had to tell myself to do just that. in the meantime I looked at over 2000 houses on line and found 3 I would be sort of happy with, so for me it was easy to hang in there knowing that this house was absolutely the best one for us and if we didn’t get it, there was no time wasted or feeling like we missed out on another one. and here’s the good part, prices are still droppping so I felt like we would eventually get something and it would be even cheaper! so time was for once on our side. but even with all that I was still frustrated every day.

anyway That’s my story, I really hope my comments help, others who write here have really helped me, so… hang in there!

UPDATE: Well today I decided to go look @ another house in a really nice neighborhood that wasn’t a short sale it was a beautiful home but didn’t have enough property the short sale we like has 2 acres. I was mad @ my realtor for not giving me updates when she got them so I told her about the other house we found that we liked and amazingly she tells me she received an email this morning and that we are finally in stage 3 and that we were assigned to a woman that prepares the documents for the closer has anyone ever heard of this and if so can I start getting excited now? And if they have not countered by now do you think we will get it for what we offered?

hi everyone, its now been 5 months and 3 weeks and I still havent heard a damn thing. The sellers realtor said they need an extension till January 15, 2010. We been waiting for Freddie Mac to approve this sale and its driving me crazy. I dont know what to do anymore does anyone have a suggestion on what I can do. How much longer do I have to wait???

@ Hanginthere , Congratulations on the house! What a great holiday gift!
I know what you mean about looking at a lot of houses and this is teh one that we want too.
Lacy, I dont know if it changes too much. The guy who is selling our house is employed. This was an investment property for him. Like I said we got an approval, but we still can’t open the file. So the seller doesn’t want to say anything since he is not sure he is going to accept what they tell him…i.e. that he is going to ahve to pay or be liable for the difference.
I think something shady is going on. Maybe I am just reading too far into it, but to not get a response on resending a file and the listing agent not doing EVERYTHING she can to get it in a format that she can read. I think that maybe the seller didn’t get what he wanted and is now stalling for time. I think that is why I chose ‘stressed out’ because I read too far into things and ‘stress myself out’!

Well, we were finally able to open the approval letter 10 days after getting it, and it is exactly what we thought would happen. Apparently there is a paragraph in there that is holding our seller liable for the difference. So, he is not signing the approval letter and is trying to negotiate with BOA. Kindof figured this would happen since it was an investment property, but hopefully they will see that they would be liable for even more if they went to foreclosure that after they negotiate they will sign the approval.
Has anyone gone through this? Do they only have until the deadline in the approval letter to negotiate or can they keep negotiating after that?

Stressed Out: To me, I find it suprising that the seller didn’t know he would be liable unless the bank offered him a forgiveness of the debt. I think under most circumstances the seller has 15 years to pay off the remaining amount owed without interest. However, I could be wrong – I usually am.

@ Stressed Out
Well, good luck! I wish you the best.

Update on my progress. Seller’s realtor informed us yesterday that she is supposed to have a pay off for the first mortgage holder (Citi) in two days AND that that the BPO’s have not been uploaded into B of A’s system as of yet and an updated HUD which she will send as soon as the payoff from Citi is received.

Can anybody shed any light on what stage of the game I am in? Maybe I am being too hopeful, but it sounds like B of A is requesting a payoff figure from Citi – so it sounds like I am getting near the end, right? History: Contract was signed late July, finally got to B of A in Mid-August. Citi aggreed to the short sale within a month. Late ocotober it went to Phase I Negotiator for B of A. Two weeks ago BPO’s were ordered and done. That’s about all I know….

please say i’m right. please.

Merry Christmas!! All we wanted for christmas was our house I’m beginning to think phase 3 is gonna be just as long as phase 2 does anyone know how long phase 3 normally takes?

I’m getting so impatient I know its only been 8 business days since we heard from the phase 3 negotiator saying she was preparing documents for the closer but I’m soooo ready to hear something! I guess the holidays probably slowed things down to but this phase 3 lady is supposively leaving soon and we haven’t heard anything from her since dec 17th wtf!!! How long does this phase 3 take and does this mean we are getting our house? Who is the closer and if they haven’t countered yet will they this is so freaking frustrating!

My realtor just got off the phone with BOA and they told her our file has been with the phase 3 CLOSER since 12-18-09 and evedentally this person has 35 days to make a decision! I can’t believe this so I guess the phase 3 negotiator had 30 days and there is another person in phase 3 called the closer that also has 35 days that’s NUTS!!!

@ longsale thanks for the response! Back in oct my realtor was told our file went to the investors but we had a horrible phase 2 negotiator she was still emailing us when we were in phase 3 and she never told us there was someone else assigned to our file! Very confusing I know so we still have no idea if our file actually went to investors or not! I hope they don’t tell us next that our file is going to investors after the closer jan 11th will be 5mths for us.

Our short sale is now going on 4 months. Our last update from the bank was December 1st. Me and my wife are really starting to loose our minds. It seems the listing agent can’t even get us another update. I wish we could find another house, but it seems every house we find is another short sale. SOMEONE HELP US!!

@ M&M: The short sale process is very frustrating I know like I said its been 5 mths for us! We also have looked @ several houses but none compare to the ss and are way overpriced for this market. The ss home we found the guy owes $205,000 on the loan balance and we offered $130,000 that’s a $75,000 short so what keeps us going is I keep telling myself your crazy if you don’t wait out this deal its almost a brand new home hardly any repairs besides cleaning so if you love the house and you don’t have to move right away hang in there your deal will probably get done! We had a phase 2 negotiator from another planet I really think she might have been an alien lmao if the closer is from earth I think we might make it! Another word of advice email this lady she is the vice president of the ss dept she emailed me back within 15 minutes on monday telling me they would look into it [email protected] her phone # is 972-526-6970.

Just found out some interesting news from my realtor who is also the sellers realtor she spoke to the seller this morning and he said he pulled his credit from all 3 bureaus and his home loan isn’t on there anymore does anyone know what this means? I asked her did it show paid off or paid as agreed and she said he didn’t say all he said was its gone!

So I had an update on friday from the listing agent with a new twist…ughhh.

So now Bank of America (the 2nd loan holder) is saying that they need to send the file to PMI for approval. So far they haven’t said anything about sending to Fannie Mae for approval. However, the more I research and speak to people – I find out how odd it is for a 2nd loan to have PMI. Any thoughts, comments??

I am so worried about our ss home it has been vacant for 7 mths and no power! I live in north florida and we are experiencing the coldest winter in 25 yrs. We asked the seller to please go wrap the pipes which he didn’t do so we went over there and did it! The house is starting to look really bad I wish BOA would get off their *ss and approve us or @ least respond back.

Has anyone else had a phase 3 closer send it to their manager? Do closers have to have their managers signature before producing the approval letter?

I’ve been involved with a BOA ss (they accepted offer in June) on a home in Florida for exactly one year now and it has been a complete nightmare. Communication from the listing agent has been virtually non- existent (going through outside realtor) from day one and when info is provided it is usually very vage. The next problem (and the worst) began in July when the second mortage was sold to Green Tree just as we were nearing acceptance from the original 2nd lender. Green Tree has been extremely difficult to work with and from everything I could find out about them on the web it appears I’m not the only one having problems with them when dealing with a ss. It’s apparent they don’t give a damn if the home goes to forclosure or not. BOA has extended their deadline once already and now we’re closing in on their second dealine and possibly seeing the home go into forclosure. The listing agent says the negoiator is very hard to contact, but I’m not sure how aggressively she’s pushing it. We have met all their requests which started with a demand for 10% of sale price, but later accepted 5% with BOA providing 3K and the rest from the seller. Final documents requested by them have now been on the negoiators desk for 1.5 months and haven’t heard anything since. Does anyone have any suggestions how we could get the sale completed? I’ve asked the listing agent if I could talk to someone at either of the banks but was told I wasn’t allowed to. This is the most frustrating experience I’ve been involved with, especially due to no ability to be part of the process and left in the dark through the whole process. I heard a 2nd mortgage can be trouble when dealing with a ss, but never thought it would be this much of a nightmare.

Henry,

I agree completely with Lacy as I have done the same thing and have got involved. I emailed Ken Lewis, the CEO of Bank of America (althought I think by now he might have stepped down) and his office responded back to me in a week and the file was escalated.

It sounds like you need to contact Green Tree though – thats where it seems like the problem lies since B of A is ready to go. Research the net and get emails and phone calls – you will have to be pro-active to get the ball rolling – dont rely on the listing agent.

I received an e-mail from Ms Dawson at BoA within 5 hours of sending it and she sent it on to their escalation team. My first attempt to contact Green Tree hasn’t produced a response, but I’ll keep trying. Thanks again

Had a email today from the seller’s agent where she forwarded a email from the bank of america negotiator. The file officially went to PMI for review yesterday.

BUT

Now I have the bank of america negotiator name, address, phone number and possibly email. bwuahaha Won’t bother her yet – let’s see how she does first.

@ longsale: I hope that’s good news for u maybe the seller will sign I hope so! I had a very interesting day today to I received an email from a manager @ boa that I emailed tuesday she gave me the new negotiators email. Remember I said it had went to a manager @ boa in arizona well I emailed the new negotiator who the manager gave the file to today literally begging for his help and so did my realtor and I can’t believe it but he emailed me back saying he was on the phone with my realtor I started crying in excitement this is the first negotiator in 5 mths that has ever called my realtor! She called me and we both were just screaming in excitement someone really does work @ boa! He told her we had to have a new appraisal because ours was so old and he told her if she hadn’t been contacted by the appraiser in 48 hrs to call him back he also said as soon as the appraisal came back he could get us an answer! I pray to GOD he is serious we have been jerked around so much! We found out the reason our file went to arizona is because the BOA in texas is so backed up! Good luck to everyone else I will keep yall posted!

@ longsale: I’m so happy for you isn’t it strange that were both finally getting somewhere @ the same time! The appraisers office called today to set up a time to see the house we found out the last appraisal was $184,000 which is way to high for the home! Our offer is $130,000 so I pray this next appraisal is lower my realtor said she’s bringing comps to show the new appraiser to try to show that the house is not worth $184,000. I’m so nervous I don’t want them to counter offer! Wish us luck!

Thanks Lacy! Yes, it is strange – hopefully we can both close right around the same time. I spoke to my realtor and he thinks we should have the approval letter next week sometime. My mortgage guy doesn’t wanna move forward until there is written approval – better be safe than sorry!

@ Lacy: Make sure they do a interior BPO! And its great for the realtor to be there to show them comps. Good luck and let me know how it goes!

@Iwannamove: Sorry to hear about it, B of A just sucks in general. My offer (and I think Lacy’s) have been in since July so dont feel bad. Couple of things that you can do: Email call the CEO office – I did that and somebody called me back right away. Also, if you scroll up a little I think Lacy posted the email for the head of the short sale department. How is your realtor and the listing agent realtor? If they are not pro-active in getting the short sale done – your file will sink to the bottom of somebody’s desk. Don’t get discouraged though – I put my offer in in July and my BPO’s were done in Mid December and I got verbal approval this past week.

@ longsale: The appraisal comp called my realtor yesterday and set up the appraisal for tuesday afternoon! They do a full appraisal inside and out my realtor said she’s going there with her guns loaded lmao she’s bringing comps and anything else she can think of. The negotiator said as soon as he gets the appraisal he sends it to pmi and should have us an answer fast! he said we should be able to close by febuary. Good luck!

I’m going to meet the current owner, who I have become friends with, at the house today. She is great.

@ Lacy: Great! PMI only had my file for a day so hopefully it is the same for you! If your realtor is bringing comps that support your asking price – you should be goood!

@ iwannamove: I’m not sure who the current CEO is, Ken Lewis did retire – but just do a google search and you can find out who it is. I’ve heard Kimberly Dawson responds pretty quick also. I would nag the Title company also – give them a call twice a week and ask for updates.

@ Ivis: Unfortunately, it seems as if there is no real time line and it really depends on who is working on your file. When did you put your offer in? Have they done the BPO’s yet? Phase II negotiator usually gets all the information gathered and then passes it along to the investor or PMI company for approval.

Henry: great news! Stay on that Matthew. I might also shoot another email to Dawson and tell her that Green Tree is working on it right now so a extension might be needed. Keep us updated!

Please help. I have been working on a short sale for almost 4 months now and just recieved a negotiator last week. I love this house but am concerned about getting it in time for the tax credit. What should i do?

Long Sale,

Well I put the offer on December 29, the sellers are outside the country, and seem they get divorsed so each one is in a diferent country, so take more time for them to sign the paper, both sellers signed by January 4.

I have no idea what is BPO.

They told me the short sale is already with the second phase negotiator. But I don’t know what that means, or how many phases are, or what I can do

The seller’s reator wrote :”"There is a 1st and a second both with BOA. We had the approval with previous buyer, but since there’s a new buyer they have submitted for approval with the mortgage insurance company and the investor. “”

Wow! Kim Dawson got back to me already in 1 hour. She just sent me an email saying they would have the team assist.

Has anyone on here ever received a counter offer from BOA. If so what was the response time once you submitted your counter offer back to them?

@ stressed out: thanks it sure has been a long road! The negotiator said once he got the appraisal he would have our answer fast I can’t hardly stand the wait its like when I was a child waiting on christmas to come! I love our new negotiator he’s so nice! Good luck everyone!!!

Well, I think this deal is about in the can and the funny thing is that Bank of America was actually not the problem…THey are the ones who were the easiest to deal with. Our guy to save money winterized the house himself and turned off all the electricity and when we turned on the water, there are lots of leaks in the house and now lots of holes and the house now looks nothing like the beautiful well put together house that we fell in love with!
Just some advice for anyone putting an offer on a short sale…make sure they leave the electricity on and lower the thermostat, or have them have a professional winterize the house.

Hi all,

First let me say thanks to whoever started this string of comments. You all have been so helpful. My husband and I have been so frustrated because we haven’t had any communication with anyone at BofA, but now that we have the contact info that you guys gave, you can bet we’ll get right on that!

Here’s my situation: we put our offer in 3 months ago (early November) and the seller accepted immediately. The only update we ever got was in December, when the seller’s agent said she had talked to the negotiator at BofA, who said he was waiting to hear from the investor (we have no idea who the investor is). Then, yesterday, we got a call from our realtor who said the seller’s agent told her we have verbal approval and now she is just waiting for written approval. So my question for all of you is: is this common? Do you usually get verbal approval first? And if you do, is it usually legitimate? I’m kind of concerned that the seller’s agent is just saying that to get us off her back because we’ve been constantly annoying her for updates. Do you think it means that we actually will get the written approval soon? Any insight you have would be incredibly helpful. It’s pretty clear you guys know more about this than I do, becuse I don’t even know what these phases are! Thanks in advance for your help.

Ashley a.k.a. frustrated future homeowner in MD (hopefully)

Today has been 5 months since my wife and I put an offer on a short sale house. It has been really tough as I’m sure everyone on this blog knows, but today I can say it has paid off because WE FINALLY GOT OUR VERBAL APPROVAL TODAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks Lacy! It’s been tough and I know how you feel, but hang in there. It sounds like your negotiator is either in the middle of working on the appraisal or just really swamped. I never thought we would receive an answer, but we did. It will happen for you too, just keep praying!

Congrats,
I just got a call from my realtor asking me to sign an addenum to close within 30 days. This is not approval but the negotiator is requesting this. What does this mean?

Randy: The negotiator is requesting this???? I’ve signed extensions of the contract a couple of times so the contract didnt’ expire but never had the negotiator ask me to sign anything.

@ randy: This must be new because the negotiators have never asked me for that! I hope this is good news for you good luck!!

@ longsale: No news yet I don’t know what’s going on I called my realtor yesterday but she didn’t answer! She’s been kinda short with me this week I think I’m getting on her nerves! Its just soooo hard being this close and not knowing anything they still haven’t countered or told us the appraisal. Do u think the realtor could of taken another offer? I don’t know why but I’ve had this horrible feeling all week! She was saying last week by law she would have to take all offers but she said she’s been telling everyone there’s a strong offer and contract on the house. I don’t know why she was talking about it and I asked her did she have another offer and she said no. I was thinking since our new negotiator said once he got the appraisal back we could possibly close by feb 11th that sounds like verbal approval to me and she shouldn’t take any other offers! I’m probably just being paranoid this whole ordeal has made me depressed and bipolar lol! I will keep yall posted I decided not to ever call the realtor again she can call me!

@Lacy: Sorry to hear. This equator system is funny – Why do some files go through equator and others dont. Mine never had a mention of Equator. Must be so frustrating. I know mine is frustrating and it actually seems like I may have a answer soon.
As far as another offer – I know my realtor put a clause in the contract of “First Right of Refusal” – I think thats how it’s worded. It basically means that other offers can come in but the bank can not look at them until the bank has declined mine. I also wouldn’t worry if I was you – there offer would have to start from the beginning of the process…

Hang in there!!

I didn’t hear back from B of A today to see if they would accept Citi’s payout. I hope to hear from them tomorrow or else I will be a nervous wreck all weekend.

Lacy, That is fantastic news. I think it sounds like you will have your answer. Only one more week of waiting and you’ll be able to get the tax credit to hopefully if you qualify. This whole process has me on an emotional roller coaster all I can doe is pray and know its in Gods hands. I don’t know what to make of this addendum I had to sign. Hopefully I get an answer in time for the tax credit. Best wishes to all and keep fighting.

Ha I know I was thinking the same thing.

Hey randy: I think you have until june 31st to be closed on a home in order to receive the tax credit so hopefully you will get it! We are first time home buyers so we should qualify Keep praying everytime I lose faith something happens to move it along. I sent the negotiator a thank you email last nite and he sent me one this morning saying MY PLEASURE its crazy but yall will understand that little phrase made my whole day todal lmao!!

Well my realtor just forwarded me the email from the seller saying he did in fact request the loan modification! I’m pissed off I can’t believe this just last week he was saying how glad he was that this was almost over. He said he would know by friday of next week if his loan mod was approved and let us know! I told my realtor to tell him he can take that house and shove it up his ass!! If he would have came to us earlier like a man and said I want to try to work with the bank and get my house back I would have understood but to let this go on 6 mths that’s crool. The negotiator feels bad for us he was actually filling out our closing paperwork